Committee
Social Security Committee 21 December 2017
21 Dec 2017 · S5 · Social Security Committee
Item of business
Draft Budget Scrutiny 2018-19
Thank you, convener, and good morning to everybody. First, I put on record my thanks to the previous convener of the committee, Sandra White, for all her work, especially on social security. I welcome Clare Adamson to her new role as convener—I look forward to working with you, Ms Adamson. I move to the specifics of why we are here this morning. Following publication last week of the draft budget, members will be aware that the communities, social security and equalities portfolio focuses on our overarching aims to create a fairer Scotland; to support inclusive growth; to tackle inequalities; and to promote community empowerment and the participation of people in all aspects of Scottish life. Through the budget, we as a Government have continued to prioritise funding to support our major expansion of affordable housing and to reach our target of 50,000 new affordable homes in the current session of Parliament; to tackle fuel poverty and support our targets on climate change; to regenerate, strengthen and empower our communities; to support the third sector and develop social enterprise; to promote equality; to continue our efforts to tackle poverty and inequality; to continue to mitigate the worst impacts of the UK Government’s welfare cuts; and to continue our work on policy and operational plans for delivery of the 11 devolved benefits using our new social security powers. Key points in the draft budget for the portfolio include the introduction of a tackling child poverty fund that is worth £50 million; an investment of £20 million in the empowering communities fund to tackle poverty and inequality; and continued priority for community engagement to advance equality in Scotland. Under the social security budget, we will make funding transfers to local authorities to support the continuation of the Scottish welfare fund, which has proven to be necessary to provide support for those who find themselves in emergency financial situations. In addition, we will continue to fully fund discretionary housing payments to mitigate the losses that are affecting more than 70,000 households as a result of the bedroom tax that has been implemented by the United Kingdom Government. As the committee will be aware, the Scottish Fiscal Commission has prepared forecasts to accompany the budget. You will see that, for DHPs, we have utilised the SFC forecast in full and are allocating £62 million, which is an increase of £12 million—or 24 per cent—since 2016-17. Similarly, for the Scottish welfare fund, we have utilised the SFC’s forecast of £33 million, thereby maintaining the value of the fund. The SFC has forecast that an additional £1 million may be required in 2018-19 to mitigate the UK Government’s reduction in assistance for housing for 18 to 21-year-olds; we will monitor whether that requirement materialises and make additional funding available to the Scottish welfare fund if necessary. As in 2017-18, the social security programme will continue in 2018-19 to draw on a level 4 budget of £75 million, which is held by the finance and constitution portfolio, for the implementation of provisions in the Scotland Act 2016. That approach will allow us to continue to adapt quickly throughout implementation to be effective in meeting evolving policy circumstances and expectations. We have not made budget available for the payment of benefits in advance of the completion of parliamentary scrutiny of the Social Security (Scotland) Bill. As executive competence for the benefits that are to be devolved is transferred to the Scottish Government, we will make budget available as required. Executive competence transfers will in future trigger block grant adjustments in order to provide the funding that will enable us to make budget available. Those transfers, and associated forecast expenditure, will subsequently need to be reflected in the Scottish budget. The timing of the addition to the budget will depend on when the benefit in question is devolved. For example, if a benefit were devolved mid-year, we would expect that a block grant adjustment and the associated budget would be reflected in the Scottish Government’s in-year budget revision process. The addition would then be scrutinised by the Finance and Constitution Committee and approved by Parliament. Although it is not possible to allocate funding for specific benefits until the Social Security (Scotland) Bill is passed, I can confirm that, as the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and the Constitution has said, additional funding will be allocated in-year to support the landmark step of increasing the carers allowance in the financial year 2018-19. The increase will be delivered by summer 2018, and will be backdated to April of that year. This year, alongside the introduction of the Social Security (Scotland) Bill, there have been other positive developments in the social security programme. Those include our recruitment of 2,400 volunteers to our experience panels; the decision to locate the new agency headquarters in Dundee, with a major centre in Glasgow and locally based social security staff across Scotland; the awarding of a two-year contract to IBM UK to build the first phase of the new social security information technology system that will enable us to deliver the initial set of benefits that we have announced; and the stage 1 debate on the bill, which took place on Tuesday, for which I record my thanks to the committee. All that work has been informed by our continuous engagement with key stakeholders, our expert advisory group, our experience panels, and members and committees in Parliament. As part of our transparent approach, we recently sent the committee a copy of the detailed information that we provided to the Public Audit and Post-legislative Scrutiny Committee, which breaks down the £190 million high-level estimate for the cost of IT implementation that is specified in the financial memorandum to the Social Security (Scotland) Bill. I hope that the breakdown has assisted members to see how our initial estimate for IT has been built up, and I have committed to provide regular updates on IT implementation, which will allow me to share with the committee how actual implementation costs compare over time with the initial estimates. As we continue our work, we need to remember the important role that our relationship with the Department for Work and Pensions will play throughout the devolution process; our shared and effective work is critical to delivery. The relationship is reinforced by our forums for resolution, which provide an opportunity to discuss any issues that may arise: the joint ministerial working group on welfare, which deals with policy related issues, and the joint exchequer committee, which deals with financial issues. This committee will continue to have oversight of those forums, and my officials and I will ensure that members are kept abreast of developments as we make progress. I thank you, convener, for the opportunity to make those opening remarks. I am more than happy to take questions, assisted by my officials.
In the same item of business
The Convener (Clare Adamson)
SNP
A very good morning to everyone, and welcome to the 26th meeting in 2017 of the Social Security Committee. I remind everyone to turn off mobile phones and ot...
The Minister for Social Security (Jeane Freeman)
SNP
Thank you, convener, and good morning to everybody. First, I put on record my thanks to the previous convener of the committee, Sandra White, for all her wor...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you very much, minister. The new social security system is obviously a large undertaking, given that it involves setting up a new agency and developing...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
In the social security directorate, we undertake a regular risks update—which I review monthly—against the overall plan for implementation. As I know that me...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you for that answer, minister. I open the session to questions from committee members, starting with Ruth Maguire.
Ruth Maguire (Cunninghame South) (SNP)
SNP
Good morning, minister. It would be helpful if you could explain the interaction between the fiscal framework and the social security system and say whether ...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
If you do not mind, I will ask James Wallace to assist me by explaining the detailed workings of the fiscal framework and in-year budget adjustments. It is ...
James Wallace (Scottish Government)
I am happy to tell you about that. It is appropriate to point out that the fiscal framework covers not just social security but a range of powers. In some ar...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
I know that committee members are familiar from previous discussions with the fact that there is regular contact—sometimes twice daily, if not more frequent—...
Ruth Maguire
SNP
Thank you—that is helpful. We hear that the two agencies are working well together, but is there potential for conflict? The situation is new, as you mention...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
As you will understand, it is a wee while since the negotiations took place and agreement was reached on the fiscal framework. Inevitably, across the civil s...
James Wallace
I agree with what the minister said. There can be quirks, and new issues will arise. From my perspective, working in the programme and dealing with the Treas...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
That information was helpfully set out. My question relates to the committee’s brief. Social Security Committee costs are no longer included in this portfol...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
The position is not dissimilar to last year’s position. As James Wallace said, the fiscal framework covers not only social security but the powers that were ...
Mark Griffin (Central Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Good morning, minister. I have a few questions on the Scottish welfare fund. First, I want to ask about the value of the fund. The Scottish Parliament inform...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
Thank you very much for that question. We have looked overall at the demands that have been made on that fund and anticipated how we can best maintain it to ...
Mark Griffin
Lab
In trying to predict the demand on that budget, was any attention paid in particular to demands on the welfare fund in those areas where universal credit has...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
As I understand it, the Scottish welfare fund is allocated according to the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities formula.
James Wallace
Yes.
Jeane Freeman
SNP
Although Mark Griffin has a point, he will know as well as I do that, although Citizens Advice Scotland and local authorities have produced important evidenc...
Mark Griffin
Lab
You mentioned a potential increase in demand on the fund because of the Government’s intervention on housing benefit for 18 to 21-year-olds. The new commitme...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
You are talking about housing benefit provision for 18 to 21-year-olds.
Mark Griffin
Lab
Yes.
Jeane Freeman
SNP
The Scottish Fiscal Commission has forecast that an additional £1 million could be required. As I said in my opening remarks, we will keep that under review ...
Mark Griffin
Lab
The family reunion crisis grant, which is supposed to come online towards the end of this year, is another new commitment. What additional demands is that ex...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
Forgive me, but I am not currently in a position to answer that question. However, I will undertake to do so and come back to you by the end of the day.
Mark Griffin
Lab
Okay. I move to my last question. In previous years, eight local authorities used their own funds to top up the Scottish welfare fund. Given the position of...
Jeane Freeman
SNP
The Parliament has not, of course, reached a final position on the budget, and I am sure that discussions will continue in relation to local government and o...
The Convener
SNP
Mr Balfour has a supplementary on that subject.
Jeremy Balfour (Lothian) (Con)
Con
It is actually a supplementary to the first question, if that is okay.