Committee
Public Petitions Committee, 01 Dec 2009
01 Dec 2009 · S3 · Public Petitions Committee
Item of business
New Petitions
Low-dose Naltrexone (PE1296)
I am glad that Celia Danks is still alive and that LDN has helped her so much. Bob Thomson made a good point when he asked us to think about what it would be like if a member of our families was diagnosed tomorrow. I have looked at the list of conditions that the petitioners say LDN can help and I am thinking about all the people I know who suffer from those conditions and wondering whether I should tell them about the drug. I have also lost family members to some of those conditions. That makes me think that, if anybody was convinced that the drug would work, they would fight tooth and nail to get it for their family members.The important point is about a clinical trial. You said that the drug does no harm, but the point of a clinical trial is to show that that is the case. I understand your point that one reason why clinical trials are needed is so that GPs and patients feel more confident in using LDN.I used to work for the organisation that is now called Cancer Research UK. Has that organisation or other similar ones said anything on whether they would run clinical trials?
In the same item of business
The Convener:
Lab
The next petition is PE1296. I welcome Robert Thomson on behalf of LDN Now, which calls on the Scottish Parliament to urge the Government to make low-dose na...
Bob Thomson (LDN Now):
We will not be surprised if this is the first time that you have heard of low-dose naltrexone. Your first objective should be to ensure that NHS staff and th...
The Convener:
Lab
Thank you very much, Bob. As Margaret Anne Gachagan and Celia Danks will have seen from our consideration of the previous petition, all the petitioners shoul...
Rhona Brankin:
Lab
Clearly, the major problem is that LDN is not licensed at the moment, although the drug is used in some cases. To the petitioners' knowledge, has the Governm...
Bob Thomson:
There has been a bit of a campaign, involving a loose affiliation of people, called LDN Now. Today at 4 pm, a 13,000-signature petition will be submitted to ...
Celia Danks (LDN Now):
That is not the only issue; there is also the science of low-dose naltrexone. The doctors know about high-dose naltrexone being given to opioid users—drug ad...
Rhona Brankin:
Lab
Is it licensed in other places in the world? Do people get it from enlightened GPs or order it on the internet?
Celia Danks:
Some people order it from India and Canada on the internet and some get it from their GP or go to a private GP to get it. Holistic doctors in America, for ex...
Bob Thomson:
Rhona Brankin asked whether LDN is licensed. It is important to say that many drugs that are not licensed, such as chemotherapy drugs, are routinely prescrib...
Nanette Milne:
Con
I can see the problems. There is a catch-22 situation. If the evidence base does not exist, it is difficult for doctors to prescribe. I had not come across t...
Bob Thomson:
Yes. It is routinely administered. I think that it has been used for 25 years in America, but I am not sure exactly how long it has been used in the UK.
Nanette Milne:
Con
I wondered about that, because many drugs are not prescribed here until they are approved by the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence and th...
Bob Thomson:
Naltrexone is very old: it goes back to 1967. It was initially developed for the war on drugs in the United States. The drug company was not too interested i...
Nanette Milne:
Con
I can see that we will have to ask questions, but I am not sure whether I see the way forward if there is no evidence base to take it forward.
Celia Danks:
There is plenty of patient evidence. We are talking about more than 100,000 people that we know of worldwide and at least 6,000 in Great Britain. They are ev...
Nanette Milne:
Con
It is just that, in the modern world, trials are set scientifically.
Bob Thomson:
I have lost 30 per cent of my kidney function to mesalazine, a drug that has been trialled, authorised and licensed. That does not mean that it is safe or th...
Celia Danks:
That is worth suffering for a while.
Bob Thomson:
In fact, one of our doctors has said that LDN is statistically safer than paracetamol.
Margaret Anne Gachagan (LDN Now):
We agree that we need evidence—that is why we are here; we want people to take that point on board—and need public money for it. Private money will not do it...
Celia Danks:
An old lady who lived in Falkirk was diagnosed with lung cancer and her daughter in America asked me to keep an eye on her, so I did. She was not offered any...
Bob Thomson:
We often come back to the point that part of the general practitioner's Hippocratic oath is "First, do no harm." LDN does no harm; there are no serious side ...
Celia Danks:
Nothing.
Bob Thomson:
It is incomprehensible that we are having the discussion. Why are we even talking about it?
The Convener:
Lab
I am conscious of the time. A number of members are keen on the issues that your petition has thrown up, so let us try to identify what they are.
Anne McLaughlin:
SNP
I am glad that Celia Danks is still alive and that LDN has helped her so much. Bob Thomson made a good point when he asked us to think about what it would be...
Celia Danks:
I have just written to Cancer Research UK. The first time that I wrote, it was interested, so I was scandalised when I found that it was not willing to consi...
Anne McLaughlin:
SNP
From my experience of working with Cancer Research UK, I know that it raises funds from a variety of sources, but that it is absolutely principled in that it...
Celia Danks:
It would probably be done by a university, funded by the Government. As you said, the big pharmaceutical companies will not touch the drug, as it is out of p...
Bob Thomson:
A trial is the important thing. We look to you, as public servants, to ask about all the avenues. Basically, private industry has failed us. That system does...