Chamber
Plenary, 16 Dec 2009
16 Dec 2009 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Pre-budget Report (Scottish Government Response)
No one would pretend that the Irish economy is in a good place just now, but the difference between the Irish Government and the UK Government is that the former is at least trying to tackle the problems rather than simply burying its head in the sand.
We need to consider the pre-budget report in two contexts: the economic context that we are in, and what the report means for the size of the Scottish budget.
First, I will consider the economic context. Labour's recession is already the longest and deepest since the war. The expansion of the G7 to the G8 and now the G20 has not changed the fact that Britain is the only member country still in recession. Far from Britain leading the world out of recession—as Gordon Brown told us it would do, and as Andy Kerr told us it would do in the PBR debate last year—it will be the last major economy to come out of recession.
Bleak as the pre-budget report is, it does not tell half the story. The National Audit Office audits the assumptions that are used in the budget documents. The NAO assessment of likely unemployment is 700,000 higher than that used by the Treasury. If the NAO is correct, the Treasury will have to find an additional £3.5 billion of tax rises or spending cuts just to stand still.
On unemployment, the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions today said:
"we still expect unemployment to increase again in the New Year",
so to suggest that we are out of the woods is complacent, particularly given that the Labour Government wants to increase the tax on jobs even more. It plans further rises in national insurance, which will hit not just everyone who earns more than £20,000 a year but every business, charity, school and hospital in the country.
The pre-budget report assumptions work if we assume not only that the Labour Government's growth figures are correct but that wages will increase by 5.5 per cent per annum in the medium term. That is an heroic assumption, which few people would think credible. The PBR shows that Labour plans to increase taxes in every year from this financial year to 2014-15 but, over that time, will still pay back not a penny of debt. Faced with the largest deficit in British history, the Labour Government's answer is its default one: to spend more money that it does not have.
Astonishingly, Labour plans more debt in the PBR than it did at the time of the budget. It also plans more spending, but not the spending that was demanded by lain Gray, whose call for accelerated capital was rebuffed by the chancellor. lain Gray told us last week that that was because the Treasury could not trust the Scottish Government to spend it wisely. Gordon Brown must be glad that the Treasury has never applied such criteria to his spending.
Labour's spending priority is not capital, it is interest. According to the IFS, between 2011-12 and 2013-14, Labour plans to spend 11.1 per cent more each year on debt interest.
The IFS has helpfully highlighted what is and is not in the PBR. We know that Labour plans to cut capital spending by £13 billion a year and revenue spending by £18 billion a year. We also know that Labour plans to increase taxes by £16 billion a year. However, a further £30 billion a year will have to be found from higher taxes or lower spending on top of what we already know about. Labour has refused to provide details of spending beyond 2010-11. The chancellor said that that is because the situation is uncertain, but it is anything but. Labour's debt mountain means quite simply that billions of pounds will be cut from the Scottish Government's budget for many years to come.
The Scottish Government rather helpfully highlighted today the £1.2 billion of potential spending reductions that can be discerned from the PBR. With 3.2 per cent annual real-terms reductions in the Scottish Government budget by the end of the next parliamentary term, spending would be £3.6 billion lower in real terms.
I want to touch on what another commentator makes of the PBR. He says:
"it is not enough simply to blame the ‘world economic crisis', or evil bankers."
He says that the Government needs to
"acknowledge that Labour in office has made serious misjudgements,"
and that it is
"guilty of damaging complacency in proclaiming ‘No more boom and bust.'"
He also says:
"It is insufficient to rely upon the vacuous and irrelevant proposed Financial Deficit Bill. Substance is what is needed and this is no time for deliberate vagueness."
We need to consider the pre-budget report in two contexts: the economic context that we are in, and what the report means for the size of the Scottish budget.
First, I will consider the economic context. Labour's recession is already the longest and deepest since the war. The expansion of the G7 to the G8 and now the G20 has not changed the fact that Britain is the only member country still in recession. Far from Britain leading the world out of recession—as Gordon Brown told us it would do, and as Andy Kerr told us it would do in the PBR debate last year—it will be the last major economy to come out of recession.
Bleak as the pre-budget report is, it does not tell half the story. The National Audit Office audits the assumptions that are used in the budget documents. The NAO assessment of likely unemployment is 700,000 higher than that used by the Treasury. If the NAO is correct, the Treasury will have to find an additional £3.5 billion of tax rises or spending cuts just to stand still.
On unemployment, the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions today said:
"we still expect unemployment to increase again in the New Year",
so to suggest that we are out of the woods is complacent, particularly given that the Labour Government wants to increase the tax on jobs even more. It plans further rises in national insurance, which will hit not just everyone who earns more than £20,000 a year but every business, charity, school and hospital in the country.
The pre-budget report assumptions work if we assume not only that the Labour Government's growth figures are correct but that wages will increase by 5.5 per cent per annum in the medium term. That is an heroic assumption, which few people would think credible. The PBR shows that Labour plans to increase taxes in every year from this financial year to 2014-15 but, over that time, will still pay back not a penny of debt. Faced with the largest deficit in British history, the Labour Government's answer is its default one: to spend more money that it does not have.
Astonishingly, Labour plans more debt in the PBR than it did at the time of the budget. It also plans more spending, but not the spending that was demanded by lain Gray, whose call for accelerated capital was rebuffed by the chancellor. lain Gray told us last week that that was because the Treasury could not trust the Scottish Government to spend it wisely. Gordon Brown must be glad that the Treasury has never applied such criteria to his spending.
Labour's spending priority is not capital, it is interest. According to the IFS, between 2011-12 and 2013-14, Labour plans to spend 11.1 per cent more each year on debt interest.
The IFS has helpfully highlighted what is and is not in the PBR. We know that Labour plans to cut capital spending by £13 billion a year and revenue spending by £18 billion a year. We also know that Labour plans to increase taxes by £16 billion a year. However, a further £30 billion a year will have to be found from higher taxes or lower spending on top of what we already know about. Labour has refused to provide details of spending beyond 2010-11. The chancellor said that that is because the situation is uncertain, but it is anything but. Labour's debt mountain means quite simply that billions of pounds will be cut from the Scottish Government's budget for many years to come.
The Scottish Government rather helpfully highlighted today the £1.2 billion of potential spending reductions that can be discerned from the PBR. With 3.2 per cent annual real-terms reductions in the Scottish Government budget by the end of the next parliamentary term, spending would be £3.6 billion lower in real terms.
I want to touch on what another commentator makes of the PBR. He says:
"it is not enough simply to blame the ‘world economic crisis', or evil bankers."
He says that the Government needs to
"acknowledge that Labour in office has made serious misjudgements,"
and that it is
"guilty of damaging complacency in proclaiming ‘No more boom and bust.'"
He also says:
"It is insufficient to rely upon the vacuous and irrelevant proposed Financial Deficit Bill. Substance is what is needed and this is no time for deliberate vagueness."
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson):
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on the Scottish Government's response to the pre-budget report.
The Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Sustainable Growth (John Swinney):
SNP
I welcome the opportunity to debate the United Kingdom Government's pre-budget report and its impact in Scotland. The Chancellor of the Exchequer delivered h...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
Why is Scotland the only part of the United Kingdom where the claimant count rate for people claiming jobseekers allowance has gone up in the last quarter? W...
John Swinney:
SNP
It is intriguing that Mr Purvis always has to concentrate on the negative in the analysis. We have had a 30-month period in which employment rates, economic ...
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
Will the minister give way?
John Swinney:
SNP
I have already given way, Mr Purvis.It is clear that there is evidence of growing optimism in the Scottish economy, albeit that that is not echoed on the Lib...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab):
Lab
I accept that the Government disagrees on the issue of capital acceleration; no doubt that point will dominate debate. However, does the cabinet secretary di...
John Swinney:
SNP
We are dealing with a fundamental point—fiscal stimulus and the support that the economy requires at a particular time. We must concentrate on the measures t...
Andy Kerr (East Kilbride) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to debate the pre-budget report. The actions of the Labour Chancellor of the Exchequer offer a competing vision of the future of ou...
Gavin Brown (Lothians) (Con):
Con
How will increasing national insurance help recovery?
Andy Kerr:
Lab
That is about rebalancing our public finances. People understand that the interventions that were made in the teeth of the global recession were made because...
Linda Fabiani (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
Will the member give way?
Andy Kerr:
Lab
The SNP Government was caught in the headlights of the recession. In the onslaught, it was incapable of taking any action, bar declaring that independence is...
Linda Fabiani:
SNP
I left it too late.
Andy Kerr:
Lab
The actions that my party took in government in the UK were about ensuring that we respond to the recession in a way that protects people and public services...
Gavin Brown:
Con
What? Name one.
Andy Kerr:
Lab
Germany, Italy and Japan, for instance.Public sector debt is projected to be 65 per cent of GDP in 2010-11, but it is 88 per cent in the euro zone and 96 per...
Joe FitzPatrick (Dundee West) (SNP):
SNP
I do not think that anyone has argued that the money need not be paid back. However, does the member agree that it would be better if it were paid back next ...
Andy Kerr:
Lab
The member had better put that point to Mr Mike Russell, who told members in the chamber no more than half an hour ago that somehow the Scottish budget—which...
John Swinney:
SNP
I do not know whether Mr Kerr plans to come on to the projections for the future public finances that were contained in the pre-budget report but, before he ...
Andy Kerr:
Lab
I now have 50 seconds in which to attempt to do that and I want to say one more thing about the choice of future that we have by way of reflection on the arc...
Derek Brownlee (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
No one would pretend that the Irish economy is in a good place just now, but the difference between the Irish Government and the UK Government is that the fo...
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
Will the member give way?
Derek Brownlee:
Con
I want to expand this point. That commentator is the former Home Secretary, Charles Clarke, who tells us that"the reason why this Pre-Budget Report has been ...
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
Will the member give way?
Derek Brownlee:
Con
I want to conclude.That is why, if we consider what Charles Clarke says and what the IFS says, and if we look at what is in the PBR but unsaid, we in this Pa...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
I concur with much of Mr Brownlee's analysis. I wanted to ask in my intervention—I understand that Mr Brownlee did not have sufficient time to take it—whethe...
Joe FitzPatrick:
SNP
Will the member give way?
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
I would ordinarily, but I am afraid that I do not have time.Instead, literally one hour ago, the Cabinet Secretary for Education and Lifelong Learning talked...
Maureen Watt (North East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
Will the member give way?