Chamber
Plenary, 16 Jun 2004
16 Jun 2004 · S2 · Plenary
Item of business
International Refugee Week
I, too, thank Kenny MacAskill for using this time for discussion of an incredibly important subject; it is unfortunate that we do not speak about it very often in the Parliament. I congratulate him on his motion and associate myself with his remarks.
I also want to congratulate and thank everyone who is involved in international refugee week and anyone who works with refugees—the churches, organisations such as Positive Action in Housing, the refugee councils throughout the country, the other groups that get in among the issue and the individuals on the street who just help where and when they can.
In the Parliament, we have talked a great deal recently about the skills shortage and how refugees can help to tackle it. That is correct. We must consider the issue and work out how to get the right balance.
I enjoy members' business debates, because members speak from the heart in them; that is what makes them important and special. I will speak from the heart, even though not everyone will applaud or agree with what I say. Given the subject of the debate, I must speak from the heart about particular individuals and the events that have happened to them.
I remember that, on the night before Mercy Ikolo went back to Ireland, we had a party for her in my house. Some of her friends from Cameroon and South Africa came. There were seven people in my living room who had degrees; I do not have a degree. Those seven people—among whom were two maths teachers, a doctor and a dentist; Mercy was a social worker—were unable to work. All their qualifications were being squandered. Apart from Mercy, all those people are still in Scotland—in Glasgow, in fact—and, sadly, all of them are still unable to work.
The skills shortage could be tackled by assisting people into work. However, we should not just consider people as resources or ask how they can help to address our skills shortage—we also have a population deficit. Those are two separate things. We want people to come to the country to work, but we do not give benefits, although we give working families tax credits and so on. That is fine, but how does it address the population deficit? Many members will know that people who are working might be unable to have children or bring up a family. That situation might get in the way of dealing with the population deficit.
The population deficit would be dealt with if we allowed people to come here and have children. We should also support them if they decide to go into the workplace, but if they do not and they desire to stay at home and look after their children, we should support them in that. That means saying to people that they can stay here, get full benefits and be taken care of. We must encourage people to bring their children to this country to grow up and be educated if we are to address the population deficit. The population deficit and the skills shortage are two separate issues. If we simply ask people to come from Poland or elsewhere to work, we will probably not address the long-term problem with the population.
That brings me to another story about a wee girl. Misheel is from Mongolia and tonight she is in Dungavel. She is eight years old and she is there with her mum, dad and 17-year-old brother. She came to this country about two years ago because her father, who was in a democratic party in Mongolia, was seen as a problem and was arrested and had to go into hiding. The family were in Liverpool for two years. The story is particularly painful because the little girl was selected by Liverpool City Council to be its princess on 10 July. Ten days ago, she was arrested and taken to Dungavel. Her parents had to tell her that she is not a princess but a prisoner. That is an unbearable fact and a painful situation.
Members know what I want to say about Dungavel and the lack of powers that the Parliament has on the issue. I cannot miss out the point, because I heard from that wee girl today. The wheels are in motion to send that family back to Mongolia tomorrow—they are supposed to be removed from Dungavel today. The little princess will go back to an uncertain future. It is likely that her daddy will be lifted at the airport when he arrives there because the guy is a problem for the Government. I cannot let the debate pass without bringing up that story.
That eight-year-old child could clearly be amazing for this country, as could Beriwan Ay and so many other children who have been removed with their parents. Refugee week is about the celebration of life, diversity and cultures. We must consider what we might do to encourage and grow diversity and to celebrate it so that in the future we have little children such as Percie, Beriwan and Misheel in this country. I hope that one day such people will also be in the Parliament.
I also want to congratulate and thank everyone who is involved in international refugee week and anyone who works with refugees—the churches, organisations such as Positive Action in Housing, the refugee councils throughout the country, the other groups that get in among the issue and the individuals on the street who just help where and when they can.
In the Parliament, we have talked a great deal recently about the skills shortage and how refugees can help to tackle it. That is correct. We must consider the issue and work out how to get the right balance.
I enjoy members' business debates, because members speak from the heart in them; that is what makes them important and special. I will speak from the heart, even though not everyone will applaud or agree with what I say. Given the subject of the debate, I must speak from the heart about particular individuals and the events that have happened to them.
I remember that, on the night before Mercy Ikolo went back to Ireland, we had a party for her in my house. Some of her friends from Cameroon and South Africa came. There were seven people in my living room who had degrees; I do not have a degree. Those seven people—among whom were two maths teachers, a doctor and a dentist; Mercy was a social worker—were unable to work. All their qualifications were being squandered. Apart from Mercy, all those people are still in Scotland—in Glasgow, in fact—and, sadly, all of them are still unable to work.
The skills shortage could be tackled by assisting people into work. However, we should not just consider people as resources or ask how they can help to address our skills shortage—we also have a population deficit. Those are two separate things. We want people to come to the country to work, but we do not give benefits, although we give working families tax credits and so on. That is fine, but how does it address the population deficit? Many members will know that people who are working might be unable to have children or bring up a family. That situation might get in the way of dealing with the population deficit.
The population deficit would be dealt with if we allowed people to come here and have children. We should also support them if they decide to go into the workplace, but if they do not and they desire to stay at home and look after their children, we should support them in that. That means saying to people that they can stay here, get full benefits and be taken care of. We must encourage people to bring their children to this country to grow up and be educated if we are to address the population deficit. The population deficit and the skills shortage are two separate issues. If we simply ask people to come from Poland or elsewhere to work, we will probably not address the long-term problem with the population.
That brings me to another story about a wee girl. Misheel is from Mongolia and tonight she is in Dungavel. She is eight years old and she is there with her mum, dad and 17-year-old brother. She came to this country about two years ago because her father, who was in a democratic party in Mongolia, was seen as a problem and was arrested and had to go into hiding. The family were in Liverpool for two years. The story is particularly painful because the little girl was selected by Liverpool City Council to be its princess on 10 July. Ten days ago, she was arrested and taken to Dungavel. Her parents had to tell her that she is not a princess but a prisoner. That is an unbearable fact and a painful situation.
Members know what I want to say about Dungavel and the lack of powers that the Parliament has on the issue. I cannot miss out the point, because I heard from that wee girl today. The wheels are in motion to send that family back to Mongolia tomorrow—they are supposed to be removed from Dungavel today. The little princess will go back to an uncertain future. It is likely that her daddy will be lifted at the airport when he arrives there because the guy is a problem for the Government. I cannot let the debate pass without bringing up that story.
That eight-year-old child could clearly be amazing for this country, as could Beriwan Ay and so many other children who have been removed with their parents. Refugee week is about the celebration of life, diversity and cultures. We must consider what we might do to encourage and grow diversity and to celebrate it so that in the future we have little children such as Percie, Beriwan and Misheel in this country. I hope that one day such people will also be in the Parliament.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman):
Lab
The final item of business is a members' business debate on motion S2M-1416, in the name of Kenny MacAskill, on international refugee week. The debate will b...
Motion debated,
That the Parliament notes that 14 to 20 June 2004 is International Refugee Week; welcomes the great social, cultural and economic benefits that refugees have...
Mr Kenny MacAskill (Lothians) (SNP):
SNP
International refugee week is significant throughout the world. Therefore, it is appropriate that it be recognised in this chamber. I am grateful to members ...
Johann Lamont (Glasgow Pollok) (Lab):
Lab
I congratulate Kenny MacAskill both on securing the debate and on his speech on a very important issue for us all. I add to his my congratulations to those w...
Mr Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD):
LD
I, too, congratulate Kenny MacAskill on securing the debate. It was a pleasure to sign and support the motion. I also compliment Kenny on his very thoughtful...
Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con):
Con
I, too, would like to congratulate Kenny MacAskill. It was nice to hear him speaking in such measured tones; his speeches are normally much more rumbustious....
Mr Stone:
LD
Will the member give way?
Mary Scanlon:
Con
I will give way in a second.At the Conservative conference in Dundee, we had a fringe meeting that was set up by the Scottish Refugee Council. I was delighte...
Mr Stone:
LD
Very well anticipated. Does the member agree that her point could be developed to say that such people could be brought into our system to help us to deal wi...
Mary Scanlon:
Con
I knew that Jamie Stone's intervention was timely. The interesting thing is that I asked Dr Hassan whether he would like the job in Caithness, if it was goin...
Mr Stone:
LD
Sign him up.
Mary Scanlon:
Con
I wish I could.As Johann Lamont said, more has to be done to allow refugees to work, for the sake of their respect and dignity and to allow them to keep thei...
Rosie Kane (Glasgow) (SSP):
SSP
I, too, thank Kenny MacAskill for using this time for discussion of an incredibly important subject; it is unfortunate that we do not speak about it very oft...
Donald Gorrie (Central Scotland) (LD):
LD
Looking round the chamber, I was struck by the thought that, if the members present were in certain other countries, we would all either be potential refugee...
Rob Gibson (Highlands and Islands) (SNP):
SNP
l thank Kenny MacAskill for giving me the chance to speak in this debate during international refugee week. I commend the statement in the motion that refuge...
Mark Ballard (Lothians) (Green):
Green
I thank Kenny MacAskill for making an eloquent speech and for securing this debate, so giving the Parliament a chance to celebrate international refugee week...
Ms Sandra White (Glasgow) (SNP):
SNP
I congratulate Kenny MacAskill on securing the debate, and I associate myself with everyone's remarks. All the speeches, by members of all parties, have been...
The Deputy Minister for Communities (Mrs Mary Mulligan):
Lab
I, too, congratulate Kenny MacAskill on securing the debate. At the beginning, I was a little worried that a procession of members would stand up and declare...
Mr Stone:
LD
I am sorry to return to my point, but when the Executive considers further funding, will it please bear in mind Fairshare and perhaps the Greyfriars kirkhous...
Mrs Mulligan:
Lab
I heard Mr Stone's initial bid, which we will examine.We need to be clear about the Executive's role. We have responsibility for the integration of refugees ...
Meeting closed at 17:59.