Chamber
Plenary, 29 Mar 2006
29 Mar 2006 · S2 · Plenary
Item of business
Edinburgh Tram (Line One) Bill
I start by saying how sorry I am that my colleague Rob Gibson has not been called to speak; he had important points to make about construction programmes and noise, although we have heard quite a lot about that today.
As I have only seven minutes in which to speak, I will start at the back end and offer some thanks. I thank Jackie Baillie, who was the committee convener, and Helen Eadie and Rob Gibson for being a joy to work with, believe it or not. Jackie said a lot earlier about noise and I reckon that she read her notes well, but she is an expert on noise and controlled the committee well. As well as thanking my colleagues, it would be right to thank the clerks and other parliamentary staff, particularly the audio staff, who kept me well equipped with earphones.
We should not forget the promoter's team, who did extremely well, nor should we forget the objectors. I was impressed all the way through the exercise by the standard of the objectors. It was not an easy task for them to deal with the technical detail that was put before them and argue with the so-called experts, but they did it magnificently. They certainly prepared a case that gave the committee a lot to think about when we took evidence.
There was a considerable amount of technical evidence and we were reliant in the main on the promoter's expert witnesses. We took much of the technical evidence as it was stated, and although we queried, pressed and delved—and brought about change—at the end of the day we were to a large extent reliant on the experts' information.
Similarly, we were reliant on the promoter for the forecast of costs. Quite honestly, the committee dealt with costs all the way through the consideration stage. We kept asking about costs and were informed that they were on schedule as previously stated. We all know now that that was not the case, and that certainly concerned the committee. We have expressed our concern in our report.
The other aspect that was continually hammered home to the committee about tramline 1 was that the circular route was all-embracing and there could be no deviation from it—it was set in stone. As we all know now, the route was changed in the latter stage. However, it is interesting to note that the committee queried in the preliminary stage whether there would be benefit in having an all-through service with tramline 2 linking with tramline 1 right down to Leith. We raised that point, but were told that it was not an issue.
I say to Kenny MacAskill that what we have now is, effectively, an enabling bill. The pressures are now on the councillors and the minister to ensure that the project is delivered at a reasonable cost and that the costs are fully justified and in line with all the assurances that we have been given.
I turn now to the objectors, some of whom will feel that, after months of hard work, the bill has gone through in any case and that there has been nothing in it for them. I would say that they were wrong in that view. Many changes have been made to the bill. Helen Eadie described the situation with respect to the Western general hospital. I sympathise with Margaret Smith's view on that, but the committee did consider the issue. We visited the site and walked around it. We thought about the possible implications of a tram stop and the extent of the effect that would have on travel times from Haymarket down to Granton. We took account of all that and that is why Helen Eadie and I supported and accepted the bus-link option that was delivered for us.
When we consider the loop of the whole route, we can see what the objectors achieved. The change of route at Haymarket, for example, started the process. We got that change of route, other amendments were made and the evidence is there for all to see. There were objectors who pointed to traffic blockage problems that will come about on Queen Street. We say to the councillors—this is also in our report—that they must address that at an early stage and not wait until the line is constructed. They should get stuck in now and find solutions.
The committee listened to Newhaven community council's plea for Victoria primary school's garden to be saved and the promoter went along with a change that achieved that, so that plea was worth while.
Although it may not seem that Robert Drysdale's work on the alternative route at Starbank has been worth while, the fact is that the committee walked the route on more than one occasion. On each occasion, we decided that the promoter's route was marginally more beneficial—although our view was weighted by considerations of time factors for each of the alternatives, which we had to take into account.
Much has been said about the Western general hospital and I will not say anything further.
Roseburn residents will be disappointed that the Roseburn corridor will be used for the tramline, but the committee made various improvements. For example, we secured improvements on property values, animal life and the landscape and habitat management plan. We took objectors' views into account.
Overall, the members of the committee believe that we have done a reasonable job. The bill could never have been perfect, and there were disappointments. For me, one such disappointment was that we did not set a 40mph speed limit. I did not flip-flop on that; I was consistent.
We now look to the minister, to councillors and to the promoter to ensure that, if or when this project goes ahead, it goes ahead in a properly costed way that provides value for money and meets all the criteria that we would expect it to meet.
As I have only seven minutes in which to speak, I will start at the back end and offer some thanks. I thank Jackie Baillie, who was the committee convener, and Helen Eadie and Rob Gibson for being a joy to work with, believe it or not. Jackie said a lot earlier about noise and I reckon that she read her notes well, but she is an expert on noise and controlled the committee well. As well as thanking my colleagues, it would be right to thank the clerks and other parliamentary staff, particularly the audio staff, who kept me well equipped with earphones.
We should not forget the promoter's team, who did extremely well, nor should we forget the objectors. I was impressed all the way through the exercise by the standard of the objectors. It was not an easy task for them to deal with the technical detail that was put before them and argue with the so-called experts, but they did it magnificently. They certainly prepared a case that gave the committee a lot to think about when we took evidence.
There was a considerable amount of technical evidence and we were reliant in the main on the promoter's expert witnesses. We took much of the technical evidence as it was stated, and although we queried, pressed and delved—and brought about change—at the end of the day we were to a large extent reliant on the experts' information.
Similarly, we were reliant on the promoter for the forecast of costs. Quite honestly, the committee dealt with costs all the way through the consideration stage. We kept asking about costs and were informed that they were on schedule as previously stated. We all know now that that was not the case, and that certainly concerned the committee. We have expressed our concern in our report.
The other aspect that was continually hammered home to the committee about tramline 1 was that the circular route was all-embracing and there could be no deviation from it—it was set in stone. As we all know now, the route was changed in the latter stage. However, it is interesting to note that the committee queried in the preliminary stage whether there would be benefit in having an all-through service with tramline 2 linking with tramline 1 right down to Leith. We raised that point, but were told that it was not an issue.
I say to Kenny MacAskill that what we have now is, effectively, an enabling bill. The pressures are now on the councillors and the minister to ensure that the project is delivered at a reasonable cost and that the costs are fully justified and in line with all the assurances that we have been given.
I turn now to the objectors, some of whom will feel that, after months of hard work, the bill has gone through in any case and that there has been nothing in it for them. I would say that they were wrong in that view. Many changes have been made to the bill. Helen Eadie described the situation with respect to the Western general hospital. I sympathise with Margaret Smith's view on that, but the committee did consider the issue. We visited the site and walked around it. We thought about the possible implications of a tram stop and the extent of the effect that would have on travel times from Haymarket down to Granton. We took account of all that and that is why Helen Eadie and I supported and accepted the bus-link option that was delivered for us.
When we consider the loop of the whole route, we can see what the objectors achieved. The change of route at Haymarket, for example, started the process. We got that change of route, other amendments were made and the evidence is there for all to see. There were objectors who pointed to traffic blockage problems that will come about on Queen Street. We say to the councillors—this is also in our report—that they must address that at an early stage and not wait until the line is constructed. They should get stuck in now and find solutions.
The committee listened to Newhaven community council's plea for Victoria primary school's garden to be saved and the promoter went along with a change that achieved that, so that plea was worth while.
Although it may not seem that Robert Drysdale's work on the alternative route at Starbank has been worth while, the fact is that the committee walked the route on more than one occasion. On each occasion, we decided that the promoter's route was marginally more beneficial—although our view was weighted by considerations of time factors for each of the alternatives, which we had to take into account.
Much has been said about the Western general hospital and I will not say anything further.
Roseburn residents will be disappointed that the Roseburn corridor will be used for the tramline, but the committee made various improvements. For example, we secured improvements on property values, animal life and the landscape and habitat management plan. We took objectors' views into account.
Overall, the members of the committee believe that we have done a reasonable job. The bill could never have been perfect, and there were disappointments. For me, one such disappointment was that we did not set a 40mph speed limit. I did not flip-flop on that; I was consistent.
We now look to the minister, to councillors and to the promoter to ensure that, if or when this project goes ahead, it goes ahead in a properly costed way that provides value for money and meets all the criteria that we would expect it to meet.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Murray Tosh):
Con
The next item of business is a debate on motion S2M-4129, in the name of Jackie Baillie, on behalf of the Edinburgh Tram (Line One) Bill Committee, that the ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab):
Lab
I will take great delight in moving the motion in my name. As I said earlier, it is approximately 50 years since trams ran in the streets of Edinburgh and, w...
Margaret Smith (Edinburgh West) (LD):
LD
I hear what the member says. I will discuss the issue further but, for now, will the member clarify where the bill secures the future of the feeder bus servi...
Jackie Baillie:
Lab
We have a written undertaking between the promoter and the committee, which is on the record and will be enforced. Further, NHS Lothian will have to be invol...
Margaret Smith (Edinburgh West) (LD):
LD
I thank the committee for its hard work over the past two years. I echo Jackie Baillie's comments about the impact on the committee of decisions that were ta...
The Minister for Transport and Telecommunications (Tavish Scott):
LD
Last week, the Parliament agreed to pass the Edinburgh Tram (Line Two) Bill. Today, we will decide whether to complete the Edinburgh tram network proposals t...
Mr David Davidson (North East Scotland) (Con):
Con
Will the minister take an intervention?
Tavish Scott:
LD
I will be happy to give way when I have finished the point.When I gave evidence to the committee in February, I said that there are many calls on the transpo...
Mr Davidson:
Con
When the minister decided on behalf of the Executive to sponsor and fund the loop, did he do so on the basis that money would be drawn down on a pro rata bas...
Tavish Scott:
LD
As I made absolutely clear in my statement on major public transport projects, we will fund what is now in front of us—that is, the tram network between Leit...
Mr Kenny MacAskill (Lothians) (SNP):
SNP
We will support Margaret Smith's amendment and will not be able to support the motion if it remains unamended.To some extent, the debate is a rerun of last w...
Tavish Scott:
LD
That is absolute rubbish. What about the £150 million for phase 1?
Mr MacAskill:
SNP
The Executive might have committed to phase 1, but it has not committed itself to phase 2.
Tavish Scott:
LD
I wonder whether Mr MacAskill can tell me the exact transport and railway advantages of phase 2.
Mr MacAskill:
SNP
It is quite clear that phase 1 does not go far enough with regard to access. It is also disingenuous to suggest that phase 2 is simply about property develop...
Jackie Baillie:
Lab
Will the member give way?
Mr MacAskill:
SNP
I cannot—I am in my final minute.This is the wrong scheme. It fails to deliver what is necessary for the city of Edinburgh and it is not the major strategic ...
Mr David Davidson (North East Scotland) (Con):
Con
First, I acknowledge the diligence of committee members and clerks in dealing with this enabling bill. Committee members must be dreadfully disappointed with...
Margaret Smith:
LD
If members know the location of the Western general hospital, they will know that as well as that hospital on Crewe Road South, where I suggest that the tram...
Mr Davidson:
Con
I thank the member for that guided tour of a hospital in which some members of my family have been treated. Despite all that, there must be a flexible system...
Helen Eadie (Dunfermline East) (Lab):
Lab
I agree with Jackie Baillie's comments. We are delighted that we have come to the end of the line on the bill. Like her, I will in the future hide from the w...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman):
Lab
One minute.
Helen Eadie:
Lab
I say for Margaret Smith's benefit that I have a copy of the written undertaking from the office of the City of Edinburgh Council guaranteeing that that bus ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
You must finish now.
Helen Eadie:
Lab
In supporting the promoter's route with the addition of the feeder bus service, the committee believes that it has gone even further to ensure that the hospi...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
I regret that, because of lack of time, I am unable to call any back benchers. We move to the winding-up speeches and I call Margaret Smith. Ms Smith, you ha...
Margaret Smith:
LD
I have heard what committee members have said about the feeder buses. In paragraph 339 of the committee's report, on the issue of accessibility, the committe...
Susan Deacon (Edinburgh East and Musselburgh) (Lab):
Lab
Does the member acknowledge that at least the Western general will be serviced by the proposed tramlines, unlike the Edinburgh royal infirmary in my constitu...
Margaret Smith:
LD
I have no problem with supporting the idea of a tram network and I have had no problem with supporting the beginnings of both tramlines, which is obviously a...
Margo MacDonald (Lothians) (Ind):
Ind
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. As a back bencher with an interest in transport in the city of Edinburgh and a local member, I have sat here patientl...