Committee
Finance Committee, 12 Dec 2006
12 Dec 2006 · S2 · Finance Committee
Item of business
Relocation of Public Sector Jobs
Since I spoke to the committee in June, there have been significant developments in relocation and in the committee. Today is the last time this session that I will report to the committee on relocation.I will start by reflecting on the context of the report. The Executive's relocation policy was inaugurated in 1999 by the then First Minister, Donald Dewar, who spelt out the new Executive's aim of dispersing Government jobs as part of our wider aims to create a more accessible, open and responsive Government and to share throughout Scotland the benefits and opportunities that such jobs bring.Our policy has had an important influence on those around us, in Ireland, Wales and the rest of the UK. The policy took effect soon after the announcement was made and, to date, we have reviewed 3,855 jobs, relocated 2,834 outside Edinburgh and decided on the proposed location of a further 1,001. That is no mean achievement, which is truly spreading the benefits of devolution throughout Scotland.We have also worked hard, with the help of your committee, on the development of the policy. Key milestones have included the inception of an additional strand of the policy—the small units initiative—in 2002; a renewal of our commitment to Government job dispersal in the partnership agreement of 2003; and, quite important, the Finance Committee inquiry in 2004 that identified a number of key issues that were also touched on by Audit Scotland in its recent report.We also published the relocation guide in June 2005. The guide was approved by the committee and by the civil service unions. It sets out a standard and agreed methodology for the application of the policy. We have come a long way in the past seven years and I think that we have made significant progress.The Audit Scotland report into relocation, which was published on 21 September and which considers 12 case-study relocations, thus comes at an apposite time. The Executive welcomes the report. It provides further useful analysis of the policy, sets out recommendations for the future of the policy, recognises the progress that has been made since 1999 and echoes the previous findings of this committee. We have taken on board the recommendations of the report and I will be happy to take your comments on the issue shortly. As the convener has pointed out, the Audit Committee will meet next week and in early January to consider the report.I previously promised the committee that we would publish an evaluation into the relocation policy. The document that you have in front of you is the draft of that report, pending comments from the committee. As we promised, we have completed a three-strand evaluation: it looks into the effect on organisations, including the effect on costs; the effect on the receiving community; and an international comparison of relocation policies and practices in other Administrations.The evaluation was an internal evaluation by the relocation policy team, but it drew on existing independent research evidence and conclusions. As the report notes, expert opinion suggests that it is not possible to assess the full impact of relocations until at least five years after an organisation has moved. In no instance do we yet have such data as the relocations in question are more recent. Bearing that caveat in mind, we have nevertheless attempted to draw out the main impacts that can be discerned to date. I would be happy to take your questions on those impacts.In addition to enabling us to acquire a better understanding of the relocations to date, the evaluation process has also brought a number of lessons to our attention. We must consider those lessons further in our future work.We have continued to make progress on relocation reviews in recent months. Since I last reported to the committee, ministers have decided that Caledonian MacBrayne's asset-owning company—or vesco—should be located in Port Glasgow. The first staff have now moved into their temporary accommodation.As we announced on 24 November, we have decided that it is not appropriate to take a decision at this time on the relocation of Registers of Scotland. Registers of Scotland is implementing a large change programme that is scheduled to achieve significant efficiencies. It is important that relocation should be managed within that context. We have therefore asked Registers of Scotland to report back to us within the next year to advise on how relocation can be integrated into the change programme. Our decision on Registers of Scotland is consistent with previous decisions not to proceed immediately with location options until the relevant body's wider organisational needs and circumstances are clearer. Our decision should not be seen as any weakening of our commitment to relocation policy and to the benefits of sharing public sector employment opportunities across Scotland, particularly in areas with social and economic needs. I confirm today that we have five location reviews in progress. They are for the new police complaints commissioner for Scotland; the Scottish legal complaints commission; creative Scotland, which will draw together the Scottish Arts Council and Scottish Screen; the Scottish charity appeals panel; and the new co-operative development agency, which we announced last year. Together, the reviews are considering the location of a further 200 public sector posts. As with previous reviews, our final decisions will take account of the business needs of each organisation, the potential socioeconomic benefits for the areas receiving posts and our wider commitments to efficient government and value-for-money considerations.The committee has previously requested that I give an update on progress attracting United Kingdom relocations to Scotland as well as information on our own relocation reviews. In October, we organised for the office of Government commerce's programme manager with responsibility for UK relocations to come to Scotland to hold a seminar for local authorities and enterprise companies to explain the UK policy and to explain what localities can do to advance their case for some of the jobs that are being relocated to Scotland. We continue to further our links with the UK and to ensure that we are raising the profile of the benefits of operating in Scotland.We have much to be proud of, but we are not complacent; there is obviously still more to be done. I would be happy to take questions on any of the issues that I have mentioned.
In the same item of business
The Convener:
Lab
Item 2 is evidence on the relocation of public sector jobs. We have been receiving six-monthly progress reports since we completed our inquiry into relocatio...
George Lyon:
LD
Since I spoke to the committee in June, there have been significant developments in relocation and in the committee. Today is the last time this session that...
The Convener:
Lab
As you know, the committee has been concerned since the early days about the process for initiating relocation reviews: a review is triggered by a reorganisa...
George Lyon:
LD
Last time I appeared before the committee, I mentioned that we were appraising all the property in Scotland that the Executive and other organisations own. W...
The Convener:
Lab
A timetable for that would be helpful. You are in the process of creating a database of properties available for relocation, but what incentive will there be...
George Lyon:
LD
Best-value and efficient government initiatives in local government will provide managers with opportunities to consider co-location and shared services.
Jim Mather:
SNP
I note that future evaluations of the benefit of relocations will take place five years down the line. Have lessons been learned from efficient government in...
George Lyon:
LD
The member raises an important point. The evaluation has thrown up weaknesses. Trying to establish baseline costs is much easier with standalone organisation...
Jim Mather:
SNP
Are there any plans to involve the receiving local authority in the process? Will the local authorities that receive the relocated jobs carry out an evaluati...
George Lyon:
LD
We have tried to discern that from local authorities and enterprise companies. Our point was not that it would be five years before we measured the impact. I...
Jim Mather:
SNP
There is a slight contradiction in that, although we have a question mark over the full future impact and benefits of relocation to the receiving end, you ha...
George Lyon:
LD
What we did in the evaluation was look at the number of jobs created in Edinburgh and the impact on its economy. From 2000 to 2004, the Edinburgh economy cre...
Jim Mather:
SNP
I hope that you understand the contradiction. If you can evaluate the impact of taking jobs out of and bringing new jobs into Edinburgh, it should be equally...
George Lyon:
LD
We are at the forefront of relocation. The best advice that we are receiving from Experian, which has done the work, is that it takes a little longer to meas...
Mark Ballard:
Green
Every local enterprise company may want relocation to its patch, but the Finance Committee is trying to investigate the net impact on, and the value for mone...
George Lyon:
LD
It is not a snapshot. We have taken information on the number of jobs created between 2000 and 2004—the latest figures—and looked at evaluations of the job m...
Mark Ballard:
Green
Surely the question should be what the impact of that job transfer has been. Would Edinburgh have thrived more or less without a transfer? Simply saying that...
George Lyon:
LD
With respect, I think that it does. If relocation had had a negative impact on Edinburgh, we would not have seen the number of jobs created rise as dramatica...
Mr Arbuckle:
LD
Looking at the policy and where the various relocations have taken place, I wonder whether the criteria are correct. I know that you have indicated time and ...
George Lyon:
LD
The criteria are balanced—50 per cent depends on the social and economic needs of areas and 50 per cent depends on business efficiency and benefits to the or...
Mr Swinney:
SNP
You said that most of the jobs went to deprived areas and that it was not surprising that so many went to Glasgow, but a number of those bodies have gone to ...
George Lyon:
LD
The decisions on the ETLLD and Transport Scotland were influenced by strong business case reasons about the ability to do business, as well as socioeconomic ...
Mr Swinney:
SNP
Yes, but my point is that although the policy has been sold as one that will benefit deprived areas, there is no discernible evidence or pattern to demonstra...
George Lyon:
LD
In part, the issue is about the business case and whether suitable buildings exist. If I recall correctly, the sportscotland relocation involves a new build ...
Mr Swinney:
SNP
The draft report says that all local enterprise companies in Scotland have been affected by relocation, but in the case of Tayside, part of which I represent...
George Lyon:
LD
I am keen for jobs to be spread throughout Scotland. Of the 32 local authorities, 25 have appeared on shortlists and 19 have received locations or relocation...
Mr McAveety:
Lab
I welcome the relocation of sportscotland to G31, which is a more interesting postal district than G2 could ever be in the city of Glasgow. Obviously, that m...
George Lyon:
LD
The points that you raise with regard to areas being able to prepare and the issues about travel to work are important. In reporting to the committee, I have...
The Convener:
Lab
On that note, I encourage committee members collectively to stick to the strategic high ground that the committee has occupied for the first three and a half...
Mr McAveety:
Lab
A bit of Christmas levity should be allowed, convener.