Chamber
Plenary, 08 Nov 2007
08 Nov 2007 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Holding the SNP Government<br />to Account
No; I will let the arts minister sit down.
We have been asked to accept a spending statement in one afternoon, with scrutiny then being passed to parliamentary committees. I am probably the last person in the chamber to underestimate the importance of the scrutiny role of committees. As convener of the Finance Committee, I scrutinised ministers rather more vigorously than some of them found comfortable. However, let us be clear about the basis on which the committees' role operates. The basis of committee scrutiny is to ask whether the policy objectives and targets that have been set out are reflected in the allocations and management of budgets. The scrutiny review that the Parliament agreed in 2005 reflected the central importance of the spending review cycle in setting spending plans, which at that time were biennial, and recommended extended detailed scrutiny in spending review years. The practical effect of the current position is that that process of extended scrutiny will not take place, because the time to achieve it is not available.
The Labour motion proposes clearly that there should be a process that will allow scrutiny to take place in detail and in principle. There is an in-principle level of political scrutiny that is best carried out in the chamber.
We have been asked to accept a spending statement in one afternoon, with scrutiny then being passed to parliamentary committees. I am probably the last person in the chamber to underestimate the importance of the scrutiny role of committees. As convener of the Finance Committee, I scrutinised ministers rather more vigorously than some of them found comfortable. However, let us be clear about the basis on which the committees' role operates. The basis of committee scrutiny is to ask whether the policy objectives and targets that have been set out are reflected in the allocations and management of budgets. The scrutiny review that the Parliament agreed in 2005 reflected the central importance of the spending review cycle in setting spending plans, which at that time were biennial, and recommended extended detailed scrutiny in spending review years. The practical effect of the current position is that that process of extended scrutiny will not take place, because the time to achieve it is not available.
The Labour motion proposes clearly that there should be a process that will allow scrutiny to take place in detail and in principle. There is an in-principle level of political scrutiny that is best carried out in the chamber.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson):
NPA
Good morning. The first item of business is a debate on motion S3M-788, in the name of Jackie Baillie, on holding the Scottish National Party Government to a...
Ms Wendy Alexander (Paisley North) (Lab):
Lab
This debate is a chance for the SNP to go "homeward" and "think again", in the words of the popular song, before it brings its budget to Parliament next week...
The Minister for Environment (Michael Russell):
SNP
I wonder whether Wendy Alexander recognises the following quotation from the Labour Party's former Minister for Finance and Public Service Reform on the budg...
Ms Alexander:
Lab
I will make it absolutely clear: stage 1 of the budget process provides the chance for Parliament to look forward and back, but the last time we had a stage ...
Alex Neil (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
Why did Wendy Alexander insist that I go after her on "Good Morning Scotland" this morning and why did she refuse to debate with me on the programme?
Ms Alexander:
Lab
That question comes from the party that refuses any parliamentary debate for 10 weeks. I suggest that you are more interested in having your spin doctors scu...
Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I am concerned that Wendy Alexander is not speaking to the motion in hand. Can you please advise on that?
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
That is not a point of order. It is entirely up to the person who is speaking.
Ms Alexander:
Lab
A few weeks ago, our First Minister told an interviewer, "Government is easy"; this week, he will have to eat those words. The SNP promised a new politics bu...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
Order.
Ms Alexander:
Lab
I recall providing £30 million when we were in government.If the public have any residual doubts, they should consider local government. The SNP's manifesto ...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
I remind members that the second person singular—that is, the word "you"—should be used only by me.
Derek Brownlee (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
Labour's motion talks of "Holding the SNP Government to Account". My proposition is simple: we should instead consider how Parliament holds the Government—wh...
Iain Gray (East Lothian) (Lab):
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Derek Brownlee:
Con
I will give way in time.Those of us who want to enhance Parliament's standing will not play fast and loose with its procedures for party-political advantage....
Mike Rumbles (West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine) (LD):
LD
Will the member give way?
Derek Brownlee:
Con
Let me make progress.
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab):
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Derek Brownlee:
Con
There are two reasons why we do not support Labour's motion. First, in seeking to add the debates that are mentioned in the motion, Labour seeks, in effect, ...
Jackie Baillie:
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
I think the member has made it clear that he is not doing so.
Derek Brownlee:
Con
If the debates are to influence the budget process, should they not be part of it? If such debates would be valuable, should not they form part of every budg...
Iain Gray:
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Mike Rumbles:
LD
Will the member take an intervention?
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
Order.
Mike Rumbles:
LD
Are you going to take an intervention?
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
Order.
Derek Brownlee:
Con
The second reason why we do not support Labour's motion is that, if what is being sought is greater scrutiny, we do not consider that the proposal in the mot...
Tavish Scott (Shetland) (LD):
LD
Does Mr Brownlee agree with what he said in the Finance Committee's meeting on Tuesday 11 September? He said:"I am not particularly happy for us to signal th...
Derek Brownlee:
Con
Indeed I do agree. We do that through the current process, which Tavish Scott described in 2003 as"a demonstrable improvement in scrutiny."—Official Report, ...