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Showing 60 of 2,354,908 contributions. Latest 30 days: 0. Coverage: 12 May 1999 — 25 Mar 2026.
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
17 Dec 2003
Budget Process 2004-05: Stage 2
The pre-Christmas budget debate promises new treats as well as old favourites this year. As last year, Rab McNeil will have to strap himself into his seat to endure 11 minutes from me on the Finance Committee's budget report. However, I am pleased to say that we will not be wi...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
27 Jun 2002
Budget Process 2003-04
I am pleased to speak to the Finance Committee's report on stage 1 of the 2003-04 budget process. I begin by offering my thanks and the thanks of members of the committee to the Finance Committee clerks and to the clerks of the Parliament's subject committees, who have made su...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
19 Dec 2001
Budget Process 2002-03: Stage 2
I thank the Parliament for this opportunity to open the debate on the Finance Committee's stage 2 report on the 2002-03 budget process. Since the commencement of stage 2 of the process, my predecessor as convener of the Finance Committee, Mike Watson, has been appointed Minist...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
17 Dec 2008
Budget Process 2009-10
Maybe there is something in that.I want to make two general but important points about the budget before speaking about climate change. Since September, when the draft budget was first produced, we have gone through some of the most cataclysmic global economic events that have...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
19 Dec 2001
Budget Process 2002-03: Stage 2
Alasdair Morgan is absolutely right. We must improve members' awareness of the budget to help them to perform their role more effectively. That can be done by training and by improving the layout of information, for example. We must also find more effective ways of making the ...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
23 Dec 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
This is my third speech in the graveyard slot in end-of-year budget debates, but it is the first when I do not have to worry about what Rab McNeil will have to say about me in The Scotsman the next day. Unlike Rab McNeil, I probably cannot promise to be entertaining, but I wil...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
28 Jun 2001
Budget Process 2002-03
We have just heard a plea for poor solicitors.I welcome the progress that has been made by a number of members in clarifying the budget. A lot needs to be done to link budget allocations better to policy priorities and, more particularly, to performance targets. I sat on two m...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
21 Dec 2005
Budget Process 2006-07
I commend the Finance Committee's report to the Parliament. It is a serious, reasoned and carefully written report, which was supported unanimously by members of the committee. The context from which we start is the budget priorities that are set by ministers. The Finance Comm...
The Convener: Lab Committee
10 Jan 2006
Subordinate Legislation
I will make a few comments, initially picking up on the point that Derek Brownlee just made. It is probably not reasonable to expect the process of scrutinising budget revisions to provide the kind of strategic overview that he suggests. Over the course of the year or of the s...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
30 Jun 2005
Economic Development<br />(Cross-cutting Expenditure Review)
I am particularly pleased to speak after George Lyon's first speech as a minister, which was the first time no one has opposed some element of what he said. However, although I am pleased to open the debate, I must note the frequency with which Finance Committee debates take p...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab) Lab Chamber
25 Nov 2010
A Budget for Scotland’s People
The reality is that there is probably less uncertainty about the general financial climate than there has been at any time in the past three years. The Westminster Government has produced a three-year budget settlement, so any uncertainty arises from the SNP Government’s failu...
The Convener (Des McNulty): Lab Committee
14 Nov 2006
Budget Process 2007-08
Good morning, colleagues. I welcome everyone to the Finance Committee's 28th meeting of 2006. I also welcome the press, the public and our witnesses. I remind people, as I normally do, to switch off all pagers and mobile phones. We have received no apologies.Under agenda item ...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
21 Nov 2007
Budget Process 2008-09
I did not always agree with Mrs Thatcher, but I agreed when, many years ago, she said that unless we are clear about what we are doing now and unless we take action now on climate change, any long-term aspirations will escape us.The Executive—or the Scottish Government, if you...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
09 Feb 2006
Budget (Scotland) (No 3) Bill
As this is the final stage of the budget process, I thank the clerks to and members of the Finance Committee, our adviser and the members and staff of the other subject committees that contributed to this year's budget scrutiny. I believe that we all did a thorough job. I also...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
23 Jan 2008
Budget (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
Despite the best efforts of Alex Neil and Tavish Scott in particular, I think that the biggest laugh of the debate came when Andrew Welsh told us that we should keep politics out of the budget process. Budgets, by their very nature, are political; they are the point at which c...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
24 Apr 2001
Budget Process 2002-03
My concern is similar to that of Tavish Scott, who was on the same committee as I was last year—not this committee—when we were conducting the budget review. That concern is that we are being asked to conduct a budget review without appropriate financial information against wh...
The Convener: Lab Committee
23 May 2002
Budget Process 2003-04
That is a fair point, Brian. I have two points to make. First, Arthur Midwinter gave an excellent summary of what we, as members, got from the morning. I hope that the people who contributed feel that there was a stimulating exchange of views. Issues arose that will, I hope, i...
The Convener: Lab Committee
16 Sep 2003
Budget Process 2004-05
Agenda item 1 starts our consideration of the draft budget for 2004-05, which the Executive published last week. The committee has an introductory paper from the clerk and two papers that the budget adviser prepared. Members should also have received copies of the draft budget...
The Convener (Des McNulty): Lab Committee
26 Oct 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
Welcome to the 26th meeting of the Finance Committee in 2004. As usual, I remind people to switch off all pagers and mobile phones. We have received apologies from Wendy Alexander and from Jeremy Purvis, who will arrive late.The first item on our agenda is consideration of the...
The Convener: Lab Committee
21 Feb 2006
Subordinate Legislation
Agenda item 2 is consideration of the spring budget revision. Accompanying the minister for this item are John Williams and John Nicholson from the finance expenditure policy division at the Scottish Executive. While the officials swap over, I thank David Henderson and Graham ...
The Convener (Des McNulty): Lab Committee
12 Sep 2006
Budget Process 2007-08
I welcome members of the press and the public to the meeting. I remind people to turn off pagers and mobile phones. The first item on the agenda, which we took in private, was on the report of our accountability and governance inquiry, which we have agreed. The second agenda i...
The Convener: Lab Committee
14 Nov 2006
Budget Process 2007-08
As regards the stage 2 report on the budget and what it is germane for us to report to Parliament about the evidence that we took on the budget revision—which obviously relates to the present financial year—I am sure that we will seek further clarification on some of the issue...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
10 Jun 2008
Budget Process (Review)
I would hone the purpose of the budget process down to three central points. One is transparency: the budget process exists to make the Government identify what it is spending money on and break it down in ways that allow scrutiny to take place. Its inclination is all too ofte...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
10 Jun 2008
Budget Process (Review)
I will add two points. One constraint of the budget process is that it is linked to an annual budget round, whereas much of the scrutiny that Mr Frizzell and others have talked about is more appropriate to a multiyear period. For example, an investigation into the appropriaten...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
21 Nov 2007
Budget Process 2008-09
There are some plans that might be equivalent to the previous level 3 plans. For example, pension issues are identified as a specific spend.Richard Wakeford raised the issue of climate change. Looking at the pattern of expenditure in the budget, it is hard to translate how tha...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
14 May 2008
Budget Process (Finance Committee Inquiry)
The first issue is transparency. This year marked a significant step backwards in terms of the data that we got, compared with those that were received under the previous arrangements that were agreed by the Finance Committee and the Government. There is an absolute requiremen...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
24 Jun 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
Alasdair Morgan is absolutely right—I was not suggesting anything to the contrary. However, the Holyrood building provides us with an opportunity to move forward, and what we are trying to do with the budget is also geared towards giving us an opportunity to move forward in a ...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
17 Dec 2009
Budget Process 2010-11
The Transport, Infrastructure and Climate Change Committee was opposed to the cancellation of the Glasgow airport rail link without a parliamentary debate being held, given that the project had been the subject of an act of the Scottish Parliament. It was said that GARL is not...
The Convener: Lab Committee
29 Jan 2002
Budget (Scotland) (No 3) Bill
One of the difficulties that we have had with the budget process is that the draft budget documents dealt with the budget by portfolio, but the budget documents deal with matters by department. There are difficulties in reconciling that. Can the transparency of the process be ...
The Convener: Lab Committee
16 Apr 2002
Budget Process 2003-04
There is an issue about the impact of mainstreaming on the social justice budget. A lot of that budget consists of discrete items, whereby funding is allocated on the basis of challenge funding. When challenge funding comes to an end and programmes are mainstreamed, that may l...
The Convener: Lab Committee
18 Nov 2002
Budget 2003-04
Thank you. In drawing the session to a close, I want to thank all the participants and the members for the useful meeting that we have had this morning as a result of the workshop sessions. In response to Jamie McGrigor's last question, we get input from the Education, Culture...
The Convener: Lab Committee
10 Jun 2003
Budget Adviser
I caution members that there is only a small pool of people who have the relevant skills and expertise. In the past, some of the people whom we have approached have for their own reasons been unavailable to take on what is an onerous set of responsibilities.I joined the previo...
The Convener: Lab Committee
18 Jun 2003
Subordinate Legislation
It was open to Fergus Ewing to lodge a motion to reject the order. That course may still be open to Fergus Ewing or the SNP when the order comes before the Parliament, should they so wish. An opportunity is still open to us to propose rejection of the order. Rejection would ha...
The Convener: Lab Committee
25 May 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
The reality is that committees have their own remits and will decide how to use their time. It is incumbent on us to do everything that we can to make information available—through our own work and by pursuing the Executive—so that budget scrutiny is as relevant and meaningful...
The Convener (Des McNulty): Lab Committee
15 Nov 2005
Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body Budget 2006-07
Good morning. I welcome to the 26th meeting of the Finance Committee in 2005 the press, the public and our witnesses. As usual, I ask people to turn off their pagers and mobile phones. All committee members are present.The first item on the agenda is consideration of the Scott...
The Convener: Lab Committee
15 Nov 2005
Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body Budget 2006-07
I understand that, but the idea that a commissioner should in effect nominate their own budget is absolutely unacceptable. The process that has been put in place involves the budget coming through the corporate body. You have scrutinised the budgets of the three commissioners ...
The Convener (Des McNulty): Lab Committee
06 Nov 2006
Budget Process 2007-08
I welcome committee members, the press and the public. We have received apologies from Wendy Alexander, who cannot be with us. I also welcome Alasdair Morgan to our meeting. He is a former deputy convener of the committee and is here as a regional member for the South of Scotl...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
10 Jun 2008
Budget Process (Review)
We have had debates for some time about the most appropriate support mechanism in relation to information. The idea of an office of the budget for the Parliament was floated four or five years ago, I think. There has also been a suggestion, perhaps from Audit Scotland, that it...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
07 Nov 2007
Budget Process 2008-09
You have summed up the situation effectively, convener. There are two focuses for us. One is the management of the department, for example in identifying efficiencies and managing performance. The second focus should be on policy choices that ministers make. Ministers will mak...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
05 Dec 2007
Subordinate Legislation
The cabinet secretary appeared unable to answer several significant questions on waste, flooding and rural development money. It will be difficult for us to agree our draft report on 19 December without the relevant information on significant shifts in the budget and with unan...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
23 Jun 2009
Budget Process 2010-11
We cannot let two years pass without looking at the transport budget in some depth and detail. Since the previous budget, we have had the strategic transport projects review. The three transport issues that are identified in the paper—the funding of major capital projects, act...
Des McNulty: Lab Committee
06 Oct 2009
Budget Process 2010-11
I want to clarify that point, Councillor Purcell. You told us that the project was handed over to Transport Scotland in good order and that you had assurances as late as September that the project was on track—I had assurances, too, because I raised that question. Suddenly, ac...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
23 Jan 2002
Budget (Scotland) (No 3) Bill: Stage 1
Although there is a certain ritual element to budget debates, it is surprising that David Davidson has delivered more or less exactly the same speech as he did last year. Perhaps not so surprisingly, Alasdair Morgan gave us a fairly lengthy speech that paid very little attenti...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
23 Jan 2002
Budget (Scotland) (No 3) Bill: Stage 1
The spending review highlights the way in which the First Minister is moving and targeting resources, and the First Minister has strongly emphasised delivery and ensuring that the money actually delivers outcomes.Consultation, as the Minister for Finance and Local Government h...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
23 Jan 2002
Budget (Scotland) (No 3) Bill: Stage 1
I will indicate the change in the budget in the five priority areas that have been identified. The budget for health and community care has grown from £5.5 billion in 2000-01 to £6.5 billion in 2002-03—an increase of 20 per cent. There has been roughly the same percentage incr...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
11 Sep 2003
Partnership Agreement (Funding)
Fergus Ewing has probably not been listening. Brian Monteith recognised that that cannot be done with EYF in a single year; perhaps Fergus does not understand that. I hope that it is something that he picks up as we go along. One crucial issue needs to be addressed. The budget...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
24 Jun 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
I thank fellow committee members, our clerks and the budget adviser, Professor Arthur Midwinter, who have done a tremendous amount of work in assimilating a huge quantity of information and in assisting us in publishing our report. On behalf of the committee, I also thank the ...
Des McNulty: Lab Chamber
23 Dec 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
There is an interesting set of issues in that question. Parliament has been fortunate in having the assistance of Professor Arthur Midwinter over the past three years. His expertise has assisted the Finance Committee greatly in identifying the reality that underlies the budget...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab Chamber
02 Nov 2006
Scottish Executive Budget Review
I have enjoyed some of the jokes in this morning's debate, but I want to highlight some of the background to the issue that we should be focusing on, which is the process of how we examine the Scottish Executive budget over the longer term and what needs to happen if we are to...
The Convener: Lab Committee
29 Jan 2002
Financial Scrutiny
The general feeling seems to be that the Finance Committee must deal with the dissatisfactions that it and the subject committees have felt about the level of transparency and comprehensibility of the budget process. We need also to give the committees of the Parliament greate...
The Convener (Des McNulty): Lab Committee
26 Mar 2002
Financial Scrutiny Review
I open the sixth meeting in 2002 of the Finance Committee and ask members to ensure that their mobile phones and pagers are turned off, as the meeting has opened in public. I have received no apologies so far.Item 1 is on the financial scrutiny review. We agreed at our meeting...
The Convener: Lab Committee
21 May 2002
Budget Process 2003-04
The quality of the subject committees' budget reports is much higher than it was previously, and I want to thank Professor Midwinter and the various committee advisers for the amount of work that they have put in. We should send positive comments back to the conveners of the c...
The Convener: Lab Committee
08 Oct 2002
Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body Budget 2003-04
Our first item is the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body's budget submission for 2003-04. I welcome the witnesses who are here to assist us with our consideration of agenda items 1 and 2. We have before us Paul Grice, the clerk of the Parliament; Robert Brown MSP, who is a ...
The Convener: Lab Committee
18 Nov 2002
Budget 2003-04
In your opening statement, you mentioned that this year the spending review took place and next year the election period will coincide with stage 1 of the budget process. It has been suggested that next year the Executive should publish a consolidated single budget document at...
The Convener: Lab Committee
19 Nov 2002
Draft Budget 2003-04 (Amendment)
Agenda item 1 is consideration of a proposed amendment to the draft budget. I welcome Nicola Sturgeon to speak to her proposal.Members will be aware that the committee has the right to suggest to the Parliament an alternative set of spending proposals at stage 2 of the annual ...
The Convener: Lab Committee
10 Jun 2003
Budget Adviser
Item 5 concerns the appointment of a budget adviser. Again, we have a paper from the clerk. As members will see, the previous committee appointed a standing adviser. The arrangement was extremely beneficial to the committee and the Parliament. As the clerk's paper points out, ...
The Convener: Lab Committee
28 Oct 2003
Budget Process 2004-05<br />(Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body Submission)
Agenda item 5 is consideration of the budget submission of the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body, as part of the committee's consideration of the budget process 2004-05. Our witnesses, whom I welcome, are Paul Grice, Robert Brown and Derek Croll. Derek Croll is with us for...
The Convener: Lab Committee
10 Nov 2003
Budget Process 2004-05
My perception—which is not just fuelled by today's evidence but which I have had for some time—is that the current institutional arrangements are serving to inhibit local flexibility and the freedom to make effective decisions at local level. The Scottish Executive is imposed ...
The Convener: Lab Committee
18 Nov 2003
Budget Process 2004-05 (Scottish Commission for Public Audit Submission)
I do not think that the committee is required to make a decision in quite the way that Fergus Ewing is describing. The issue is that the report comes from the SCPA. The Parliament makes the decision in that regard. Our interest is in the context of our scrutiny of the overall ...
The Convener: Lab Committee
02 Mar 2004
Budget Process 2005-06
The second item on the agenda is consideration of an approach paper on the 2005-06 budget process. Members will see from the paper that the committee must make decisions on three specific matters: on asking our budget adviser to produce a paper that reviews the Executive's bud...
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Chamber

Plenary, 17 Dec 2003

17 Dec 2003 · S2 · Plenary
Item of business
Budget Process 2004-05: Stage 2
McNulty, Des Lab Clydebank and Milngavie Watch on SPTV
The pre-Christmas budget debate promises new treats as well as old favourites this year. As last year, Rab McNeil will have to strap himself into his seat to endure 11 minutes from me on the Finance Committee's budget report. However, I am pleased to say that we will not be without a contribution from David Davidson, who is a fixture in the calendar as reliable as the "Morecambe and Wise Christmas Special", and possibly just as dated. There is a special bonus: Fergus Ewing will be winding up the debate. Members of the Finance Committee have been running a Fergus bingo competition in recent weeks to see how often he manages to introduce the Holyrood building into contributions on other subjects. I hope that people have got their pencils ready; the first person to shout, "Holyrood House", on hearing five separate references, wins this year's star prize.

I shall begin by highlighting issues raised by Donald MacRae of Lloyds TSB Scotland and Peter Wood of DTZ Pieda Consulting in their evidence to the Finance Committee about the priority that they felt should be given to promoting economic growth. Donald MacRae felt that there was a risk that the increases in public spending in the budget would

"make Scotland's overall economy more dependent on the public sector."—[Official Report, Finance Committee, 28 October 2003; c 370.]

Peter Wood felt that the political priority given to growing the economy was not adequately reflected in allocations to the enterprise and lifelong learning budget and expressed his concern over the lack of a rationale for the increases between different portfolios.

That concern about the lack of rationale was not confined to those experts. In their joint submission about resource allocation and budget prioritisation, the Justice 1 Committee and the Justice 2 Committee made a similar point. That report recognised that the allocation of resources is not the sole indicator of priority, but said that it seems clear that, if, as the budget grows, any increasing proportion of that budget is allocated to a specific activity, that activity is a priority. On the other hand, if, as the overall budget grows, the proportion allocated to an activity, even when widely defined, struggles to maintain a constant proportion of that budget, that activity cannot be classed as a priority.

Our two economic experts were not arguing against more public spending. Their first concern was that, if growing the economy is the top priority, that should be reflected in budget allocations, not just to the enterprise portfolio but across other portfolios as well. Secondly, they argued that we need to ensure that how the money is spent produces what Alf Young calls revenue payback, in the form of a more prosperous and vibrant Scottish economy.

Particularly when there have been year-on-year expenditure increases—at levels that are unprecedented in my lifetime—with more money for services such as health and education, we must ensure that money is invested in securing longer-term gains, whether that is done by taking advantage of research and technological change; by upgrading transport, hospital and school infrastructure; or by regeneration prospects that deliver a transformation in an area's social and economic circumstances.

Both the committee's experts felt that we need to change the balance between capital expenditure and revenue expenditure at this stage in the economic cycle, because of the importance of capital spending to economic growth. That is a complex issue, into which the committee will delve further. For the moment, however, we recommend that the relative priority that is given to capital expenditure in relation to revenue expenditure in the 2004 spending review be reviewed. We recommend that more should be allocated to targeted capital expenditure such as transport improvements, property and housing-led regeneration and other major infrastructure improvements.

To be fair to the Executive, progress has undoubtedly been made in taking forward major capital projects. The school regeneration projects that are being implemented throughout Scotland, the implementation of ambitious acute care strategies such as the greater Glasgow scheme, the Executive's commitments to the M74 link and the Clyde waterfront project are all steps in the right direction. However, given the lead-in time for major capital projects, we must use the opportunity that we have now to secure lasting benefits, not only in the physical infrastructure but through the economic stimulus that capital expenditure on such a scale can have to the Scottish economy as a whole.

The Finance Committee feels that considerable progress has been made over the past two years in securing greater transparency in the presentation of budget information. In particular, we commend the Executive for its positive response to the previous Finance Committee's recommendation regarding new spending proposals, which are now presented in a discrete section headed "New resources". The committee welcomes the introduction of a distinct section on equality, which identifies spending across departments and marks important progress on the equality-proofing agenda. It also welcomes the absence of cumulative accounting from the budget discussions that we have held with ministers. We recommend that the "Closing the opportunity gap" and "Sustainable development" sections of the portfolio chapters of the draft budget should adopt the model used in the "Equality" section and identify relevant activities and costs.

The Finance Committee would welcome greater clarity in future end-year flexibility announcements, which were delayed this year in order to factor in money that was used to implement elements of the partnership agreement. In particular, we want the Executive to work with the Finance Committee to develop time-series data on budgetary trends, ideally over a 10-year period, so as to allow a much more structured appraisal of performance across portfolios, as well as within them. There were some differences of view in the committee about how far down the levels it might be feasible to apply such a time-series analysis. Personally, I feel that we would need data at levels 1 and 2. Our goal of a 10-year period might not turn out to be technically feasible, depending on the number of baseline revisions that would have to be taken into account. However, I think that all committee members are agreed in principle that trend data are crucial if we are to have a meaningful strategic overview of the budget and if an informed debate on the choices before us on spending decisions is to take place.

We have had a long dialogue over the past year with Andy Kerr, the Minister for Finance and Public Services, and his deputies, Peter Peacock and Tavish Scott, regarding future arrangements for examination of the budget. There is a clear need to rationalise the overlap in documentation between the annual expenditure report and the draft budget. We are pleased that ministers are suggesting a way forward for 2005-06, especially with regard to performance reporting, which was a key recommendation of the previous Finance Committee's review of the budget process.

Our view is that the revised AER should take into account the changing fiscal context before committees make recommendations on spending priorities at stage 1 of the process, and that the term "annual expenditure report" should be dispensed with, reflecting a revised stage 1 of the process involving an assessment of past performance and a discussion of strategic priorities, both of which are important developments. We believe that the revised documents at stage 1 of the process should include an assessment of progress on spending priorities, including health and local government budgets, in the proposed performance report on progress against targets. That report should give specific, measurable information on such progress.

A clear and unambiguous response from ministers to the committee's spending recommendations in each portfolio chapter of the draft budget should be provided in the formal response to committee reports at stage 1. We recognise the importance of the biennial spending review, as opposed to the annual budget process, in determining changes in spending priorities. We are currently considering how the Finance Committee and subject committees might be most effectively involved in examining options and influencing decision making.

The Finance Committee remains concerned about the number of targets that are set by ministers and how they are selected. A recent report by the Westminster Public Administration Select Committee concludes that ministers need to choose and communicate clear priorities, rather than set too many targets; to concentrate on key national priorities rather than micromanagement; and to move from targets to trends as the basis for measuring progress. Our view is very similar. We think that there are too many targets and that some of the targets obscure rather than clarify what the Scottish Executive is trying to achieve. We believe that there is too much focus on activities, rather than outcomes, and that the use of targets within portfolios is all too frequently an impediment to progress on cross-cutting priorities.

We are not arguing that there is no place for targets. When they are used, targets must be properly quantified to ensure not only that spending departments are meeting their targets but that such targets are improving public services. In that way, it can be assessed whether or not better outcomes are being achieved. We are keen that effort should be concentrated on areas where progress is possible—for example, linking allocations directly to outputs—and that the Executive should concentrate on developing and meeting strategic targets, rather than departmental activity measures. The use of targets should also promote effective management, by building in incentives for those who achieve efficiency savings. Our recommendation is that the Executive should evaluate the impact of targets in practice, including assessing the delivery of improvements to public services, with a view to rationalising and simplifying the process prior to the 2004 spending review.

The final issue that I want to highlight is the scrutiny of block allocations to health and local government. As a former councillor and member of a health board, I am very sensitive to the need for local autonomy in decision making, including the allocation of resources between different priorities in line with local needs and circumstances. However, the policy and financial assumptions that underpin allocations to health boards and local authorities should be made explicit, especially when new resources are being allocated.

It used to be said that only three people understood the way in which grant-aided expenditure was allocated—one was mad, one was dead and the other was Professor Arthur Midwinter. The Finance Committee is privileged to have Professor Midwinter as its budget adviser. That has greatly assisted us in understanding what is going on in the block allocations. However, we believe that the grant formulas should be made explicit in the draft budget, so that everyone can have access to this information.

I thank the clerks to the Finance Committee, who have done a terrific job for the committee in a very pressured period since it came into being, and Arthur Midwinter, who did a terrific amount of work in bringing together a huge mass of information that has allowed us to write such a comprehensive budget report. I also thank Executive officials and ministers who have co-operated with us in meeting our objectives, and everyone else who has been involved, especially other members of the committee.

I move,

That the Parliament notes the 4th Report 2003 (Session 2) of the Finance Committee, Stage 2 of the 2004-05 Budget Process (SP Paper 62).

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Mr George Reid): NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S2M-716, in the name of Des McNulty, on behalf of the Finance Committee, on stage 2 of the 2004-05 budget pro...
Des McNulty (Clydebank and Milngavie) (Lab): Lab
The pre-Christmas budget debate promises new treats as well as old favourites this year. As last year, Rab McNeil will have to strap himself into his seat to...
Jim Mather (Highlands and Islands) (SNP): SNP
About three years ago, when I started to take the SNP economic case around the committee rooms and board rooms of Scotland, a director of one of our major ci...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Murray Tosh): Con
I now call Brian Monteith to close—sorry, to open—for the Conservatives. That was wishful thinking, Brian.
Mr Brian Monteith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con): Con
I assure you, Presiding Officer, that despite the fact that I normally wind up, today I will be opening, although I suspect that my speech might also end up ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer: Con
I call Dr Elaine Murray to open for the Labour party.
Dr Elaine Murray (Dumfries) (Lab): Lab
I see that Rab McNeil is still in the press gallery. He might be bored by Des McNulty, but he thinks that I am a dog.
Mr Monteith: Con
A pedigree, surely.
Dr Murray: Lab
I might be a bit of a mongrel, actually.Anyway, I welcome the opportunity to speak in today's debate, which is about the presentation and the process of repo...
Mr Monteith: Con
Will the member give way?
Dr Murray: Lab
I will just finish the sentence before giving way.Opposition members often say that it is their job to oppose, but their job is not just to oppose but to pro...
Mr Monteith: Con
I wholly agree with the member that it would be beneficial for the Parliament to have alternative budgets to discuss at some stage, but does she agree that t...
Dr Murray: Lab
I will refer to some of that later, but part of the point that I was making was about the difficulties for Opposition parties.It is clear that some form of s...
Mark Ballard (Lothians) (Green): Green
I thank the committee for the opportunity to comment on the Scottish budget process. We are fortunate that we have the chance to scrutinise Scotland's draft ...
Christine May (Central Fife) (Lab): Lab
This is my first year in the Parliament, so it is the first opportunity that I have had to participate in the budget process. I was quite excited about it. M...
Fergus Ewing (Inverness East, Nairn and Lochaber) (SNP): SNP
If the SNP said that it would not spend £500,000 on hedgehogs and £401 million on Holyrood, would the member agree with us?
Christine May: Lab
I would like the SNP members to say anything with which I could agree—or disagree—but they have not. They have not said how they will fund any of their propo...
Mr David Davidson (North East Scotland) (Con): Con
The member mentioned Peter and Paul. Does not that describe the Arbuthnott formula that the Executive uses to fund our health boards?
Christine May: Lab
No. In the debate last week, the Tories said that they would take money from the national health service and from schools to fund private care. They said tha...
Mr Monteith: Con
Although she is new to the Parliament, the member will know that the official report tries hard to ensure that all quotes and examples that members give in s...
Christine May: Lab
My understanding of what was said last week is that money would be removed and used for the purpose that I suggested.The Greens are too busy hugging trees to...
Mark Ballard rose— Green
Christine May: Lab
I ask the member to let me finish the point. To pretend otherwise to that point of view is to practise deceitful, duplicitous and discreditable behaviour, li...
Alex Neil (Central Scotland) (SNP): SNP
I share Christine May's aspiration that she should make a better speech next year. She started by saying that she had looked forward to the debate with excit...
Members:
Oh!
Alex Neil: SNP
To be fair to Des McNulty, ever since Jack McConnell sacked him as a minister, he has been somewhat animated—so much so that I began to think last week that ...
Christine May: Lab
Would the member like to give the chamber two examples of the Executive lying and of fiddled figures?
Alex Neil: SNP
I would be absolutely delighted and I will give more than two examples. When the identifiable public expenditure per head in Scotland is compared with that f...
The Deputy Presiding Officer: Con
Nobody seemed to disapprove of that speech too much, but I ask the remaining speakers to address—even if just occasionally—the budget for 2004-05. I call Jer...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD): LD
I shall endeavour to get back to the debate in hand. I am also a new member and, as such, I echo the comments that were made by Dr Murray and the committee c...