Chamber
Plenary, 28 Jun 2001
28 Jun 2001 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Protection from Abuse (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
As Alasdair Morgan said, this is a very special occasion: the stage 1 debate on the first committee bill of the Scottish Parliament. I feel privileged to have played a part in it, and I thank all the members who have contributed to the debate.
Iain Gray is here representing the Executive, and I welcome the Executive's support for the bill. The support of ministers is a crucial part of the jigsaw of measures that will deliver protection and support to people who have suffered abuse and are afraid of continuing abuse. As Iain Gray said, the Parliament and the Justice 1 Committee are both committed to dealing with domestic abuse. As Nora Radcliffe said, the committee was able to deal swiftly with this measure.
As I am talking about the Executive's contribution, perhaps I should address the question of ECHR compliance. Phil Gallie also raised that subject, and members will be aware that any arrest or detention must be compatible with article 5 of the ECHR, which guarantees a person's right to liberty and security. Members will also be aware that the arrest and detention procedures in the bill are no different from existing procedures in the Matrimonial Homes (Family Protection) (Scotland) Act 1981. In several respects, the procedures in the bill give the alleged abuser more protection against the possibility of arbitrary detention. The Justice 1 Committee is satisfied that the arrest and detention procedures are compatible with article 5 of the ECHR, and in particular with article 5(1)(b). Members will also be aware that the Presiding Officer has issued his statement on legislative competence, which says that, in his view, the provisions of the bill are within the Parliament's legislative competence.
Alasdair Morgan outlined the details of how the bill will work, and I will not repeat what he said. As members have said, the bill was necessary because the protection available under the Matrimonial Homes (Family Protection) (Scotland) Act 1981 did not address the realities of today's relationships. Because that act was related to rights to occupy property as an adjunct to particular kinds of relationships, too many people were excluded from protection under it. As Lyndsay McIntosh and other members said, divorcees were excluded from the protection of police powers of arrest, because they were no longer married to their abusers. Many cohabitees were excluded, because pursuing occupancy rights through the courts would only leave them open to an escalation of abuse. Same-sex couples were excluded, because their relationships had no legal standing. The extended family was excluded, although there is much evidence of abuse across the generations.
As Christine Grahame mentioned in a previous debate, the idea for the bill was a flash of inspiration from the Sheriffs Association, which was warmly welcomed by the committee and by other witnesses. I thank Christine Grahame for giving us examples today of how the present law has failed those who are abused.
The bill is welcomed by all those who deal with people who are suffering abuse. It is welcomed by organisations such as Scottish Women's Aid and Enough is Enough. It is welcomed by the police, who are often frustrated in their attempts to prevent abuse by the fact that, in most circumstances, they have no preventive powers of arrest and must wait until there is a breach of the peace or an assault before they can intervene.
Of course, abuse is not just about physical violence; there is also sexual and psychological abuse. The stage 1 debate on the bill sends several messages. It states that abuse, wherever it is found, is unacceptable to society, and that abusers will feel the force of the law. I hope that the new remedy will be widely used. I believe that, in the long run, it will be cost-effective, although there seems to be a question in the Executive's mind about how much it will cost. In the end, however, I think that we will find that it takes up less court time and less police time. It is better to prevent serious crime than to have to deal with the consequences of serious assault or even murder. The bill will prevent fear and psychological suffering. Too many people live in fear of an ex-partner or family member, and I hope that the bill will liberate them.
As Tavish Scott said, today's debate sends a message about what this Parliament can do for Scotland. This is a committee bill, which was formulated because the then Justice and Home Affairs Committee considered that there was a serious gap in the law. The bill has been thoroughly researched by the committee through extensive evidence taking, and members of the committee were ably assisted by the committee clerks, past and present. We then handed over to the non-Executive drafting team, which turned our ideas into a draft bill. Many people have commented on the bill's user-friendly language, and I thank the draftsman for his skill. I thank the head of the non-Executive bills unit, David Cullum, who oversaw the process, and Alison Coull, who provided legal advice.
I ask ministers, who support the bill, to consider closely the question of eligibility for legal aid. That issue has also been raised during the debate. People need to be able to access the justice that the bill offers. As I have said in other debates, the proposed legislation could save lives. Anyone in such danger, be they man, woman, girlfriend or grandfather, must have the protection of the law. I also ask the Executive to put in place systems to monitor the bill closely when it is passed. That is something that Christine Grahame mentioned. We want to ensure that the uses of the powers under the bill are noted and that proper provision continues to be made for people who want to use those powers in future.
The Justice and Home Affairs Committee worked hard during its inquiry and I pay tribute to all members for the consensual way in which we worked towards the solution that is being presented to the Scottish Parliament as a bill today. We have had two very useful debates on the bill and, on both occasions, the Parliament has been whole-heartedly supportive. I speak on behalf of the committee when I say that I am most grateful for that support. Once again, I thank the members and clerks of the Finance Committee and Subordinate Legislation Committee for their part in scrutinising the bill at stage 1 and in ensuring that today's debate could take place.
We have investigated thoroughly all possibilities and I think that we have come up with a bill that will genuinely help victims of abuse. The work that has been done by our committee is a great example of what can be achieved in our committee system. In my opinion, it is entirely appropriate that the first committee bill to begin its parliamentary journey is one that will genuinely help vulnerable people in Scotland. I am grateful for the support that the bill has received in the chamber today, and I am pleased to commend it to Parliament.
Iain Gray is here representing the Executive, and I welcome the Executive's support for the bill. The support of ministers is a crucial part of the jigsaw of measures that will deliver protection and support to people who have suffered abuse and are afraid of continuing abuse. As Iain Gray said, the Parliament and the Justice 1 Committee are both committed to dealing with domestic abuse. As Nora Radcliffe said, the committee was able to deal swiftly with this measure.
As I am talking about the Executive's contribution, perhaps I should address the question of ECHR compliance. Phil Gallie also raised that subject, and members will be aware that any arrest or detention must be compatible with article 5 of the ECHR, which guarantees a person's right to liberty and security. Members will also be aware that the arrest and detention procedures in the bill are no different from existing procedures in the Matrimonial Homes (Family Protection) (Scotland) Act 1981. In several respects, the procedures in the bill give the alleged abuser more protection against the possibility of arbitrary detention. The Justice 1 Committee is satisfied that the arrest and detention procedures are compatible with article 5 of the ECHR, and in particular with article 5(1)(b). Members will also be aware that the Presiding Officer has issued his statement on legislative competence, which says that, in his view, the provisions of the bill are within the Parliament's legislative competence.
Alasdair Morgan outlined the details of how the bill will work, and I will not repeat what he said. As members have said, the bill was necessary because the protection available under the Matrimonial Homes (Family Protection) (Scotland) Act 1981 did not address the realities of today's relationships. Because that act was related to rights to occupy property as an adjunct to particular kinds of relationships, too many people were excluded from protection under it. As Lyndsay McIntosh and other members said, divorcees were excluded from the protection of police powers of arrest, because they were no longer married to their abusers. Many cohabitees were excluded, because pursuing occupancy rights through the courts would only leave them open to an escalation of abuse. Same-sex couples were excluded, because their relationships had no legal standing. The extended family was excluded, although there is much evidence of abuse across the generations.
As Christine Grahame mentioned in a previous debate, the idea for the bill was a flash of inspiration from the Sheriffs Association, which was warmly welcomed by the committee and by other witnesses. I thank Christine Grahame for giving us examples today of how the present law has failed those who are abused.
The bill is welcomed by all those who deal with people who are suffering abuse. It is welcomed by organisations such as Scottish Women's Aid and Enough is Enough. It is welcomed by the police, who are often frustrated in their attempts to prevent abuse by the fact that, in most circumstances, they have no preventive powers of arrest and must wait until there is a breach of the peace or an assault before they can intervene.
Of course, abuse is not just about physical violence; there is also sexual and psychological abuse. The stage 1 debate on the bill sends several messages. It states that abuse, wherever it is found, is unacceptable to society, and that abusers will feel the force of the law. I hope that the new remedy will be widely used. I believe that, in the long run, it will be cost-effective, although there seems to be a question in the Executive's mind about how much it will cost. In the end, however, I think that we will find that it takes up less court time and less police time. It is better to prevent serious crime than to have to deal with the consequences of serious assault or even murder. The bill will prevent fear and psychological suffering. Too many people live in fear of an ex-partner or family member, and I hope that the bill will liberate them.
As Tavish Scott said, today's debate sends a message about what this Parliament can do for Scotland. This is a committee bill, which was formulated because the then Justice and Home Affairs Committee considered that there was a serious gap in the law. The bill has been thoroughly researched by the committee through extensive evidence taking, and members of the committee were ably assisted by the committee clerks, past and present. We then handed over to the non-Executive drafting team, which turned our ideas into a draft bill. Many people have commented on the bill's user-friendly language, and I thank the draftsman for his skill. I thank the head of the non-Executive bills unit, David Cullum, who oversaw the process, and Alison Coull, who provided legal advice.
I ask ministers, who support the bill, to consider closely the question of eligibility for legal aid. That issue has also been raised during the debate. People need to be able to access the justice that the bill offers. As I have said in other debates, the proposed legislation could save lives. Anyone in such danger, be they man, woman, girlfriend or grandfather, must have the protection of the law. I also ask the Executive to put in place systems to monitor the bill closely when it is passed. That is something that Christine Grahame mentioned. We want to ensure that the uses of the powers under the bill are noted and that proper provision continues to be made for people who want to use those powers in future.
The Justice and Home Affairs Committee worked hard during its inquiry and I pay tribute to all members for the consensual way in which we worked towards the solution that is being presented to the Scottish Parliament as a bill today. We have had two very useful debates on the bill and, on both occasions, the Parliament has been whole-heartedly supportive. I speak on behalf of the committee when I say that I am most grateful for that support. Once again, I thank the members and clerks of the Finance Committee and Subordinate Legislation Committee for their part in scrutinising the bill at stage 1 and in ensuring that today's debate could take place.
We have investigated thoroughly all possibilities and I think that we have come up with a bill that will genuinely help victims of abuse. The work that has been done by our committee is a great example of what can be achieved in our committee system. In my opinion, it is entirely appropriate that the first committee bill to begin its parliamentary journey is one that will genuinely help vulnerable people in Scotland. I am grateful for the support that the bill has received in the chamber today, and I am pleased to commend it to Parliament.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Sir David Steel):
NPA
The first item of business is the Justice 1 Committee debate on motion S1M-1994, in the name of Alasdair Morgan, on the general principles of the Protection ...
Alasdair Morgan (Galloway and Upper Nithsdale) (SNP):
SNP
I am sure that the attendance in the chamber says more about the press function last night than the importance of the subject of the debate. I have great ple...
The Deputy Minister for Justice (Iain Gray):
Lab
I am glad to give the Executive's support to the Protection from Abuse (Scotland) Bill, which is an important bill in two ways. As the Justice 1 Committee co...
Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
It is a great pity that the Parliament has received such bad publicity, as it is ill deserved. People just see First Minister's questions, which tends to be ...
Phil Gallie (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
I welcome unequivocally the objectives and aims of the bill. I congratulate Maureen Macmillan on her relentless pursuit of those objectives in questioning as...
Nora Radcliffe (Gordon) (LD):
LD
I commend much of what is in the bill as there is much in which we can take satisfaction. The bill is necessary and timely and its genesis and development de...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
As the debate is short, we now come to winding-up speeches, which we will take in reverse order of parties. That means, oddly enough, that we start with Tavi...
Tavish Scott (Shetland) (LD):
LD
I take your point, Sir David.I share the unequivocal welcome that the bill has received this morning. Like many colleagues across the chamber, I deal with is...
Mrs Lyndsay McIntosh (Central Scotland) (Con):
Con
Speaking as late as this in the debate leaves little opportunity to contribute something new, especially in view of the exposition that Mr Morgan gave at the...
Christine Grahame:
SNP
Having been a practising lawyer in my previous life, I did not have to be persuaded that we needed such a bill. Anyone who has operated in family law knows t...
Iain Gray:
Lab
Members of all committees know the effort that lies behind the committees' work—I know that not from experience, but because members often point it out to me...
Maureen Macmillan (Highlands and Islands) (Lab):
Lab
As Alasdair Morgan said, this is a very special occasion: the stage 1 debate on the first committee bill of the Scottish Parliament. I feel privileged to hav...