Committee
Equal Opportunities Committee, 19 Mar 2002
19 Mar 2002 · S1 · Equal Opportunities Committee
Item of business
Subordinate Legislation
Race Relations Act 1976 (Statutory Duties) (Scotland) Order 2002 (SSI 2002/62)
Before we proceed to our evidence-taking session, members might find it useful if I put our work on the order in context. The order derives from the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000, which places a statutory general duty on listed public bodies to promote race equality in carrying out their functions. We must remember that the duty does not apply to bodies that are not listed in schedule 1A to the 2000 act.Although the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000 is UK legislation, an order-making power enables Scottish ministers to impose specific duties on Scottish public authorities through an order such as the one under discussion, if a particular body is listed in schedule 1A to the act. Therefore, although we are able to comment on the UK act—as we are on any other reserved matter—we must remain focused on the options that face us concerning the order. The committee can recommend either that the order go forward, or that it be annulled, but we cannot amend it. We can discuss the order in greater detail with Scottish Executive officials and the Commission for Racial Equality on 26 March.We have received apologies from Robina Qureshi and Najimee Parveen of Positive Action in Housing, who are unable to attend because of today's rail strike. However, we have Vijay Patel from the Black and Ethnic Minority Infrastructure in Scotland, which is commonly known as BEMIS. I understand that Rami Ousta is also meant to be winging his way up here. Is he going to make it to the meeting?
In the same item of business
The Deputy Convener:
SNP
Before we proceed to our evidence-taking session, members might find it useful if I put our work on the order in context. The order derives from the Race Rel...
Vijay Patel (Black and Ethnic Minority Infrastructure in Scotland):
He could still be at Heathrow.
The Deputy Convener:
SNP
I also welcome Cathy Peattie to the meeting. I take it that the rail strike has had a similar effect on her.I welcome Vijay Patel, who has managed to make it...
Vijay Patel:
Certainly. First, I thank the committee for giving BEMIS this opportunity. I am on BEMIS's board of directors. BEMIS is quite young—we have been going for ab...
Mr Michael McMahon (Hamilton North and Bellshill) (Lab):
Lab
You have raised a number of points that the committee would acknowledge and indeed endorse. I want to ask some specific questions about the order's potential...
Vijay Patel:
The order will play an important part in that respect. I do not know whether committee members have read the race equality advisory forum report that was pro...
Mr McMahon:
Lab
Another matter that we continually raise is the availability of information that would allow groups to deliver services effectively. Will the order improve t...
Vijay Patel:
The order could improve the situation, but what is important is how it is implemented centrally and locally. For example, many local authorities in Scotland ...
Cathy Peattie (Falkirk East) (Lab):
Lab
I am interested in how the black and ethnic minority community can pick up some of the issues in the order relating to local authority services. Do you agree...
Vijay Patel:
We need motivation and commitment at the highest level—within local authorities and the Scottish Executive. In local authorities, from the chief executive do...
Cathy Peattie:
Lab
I accept that. That work has been very positive. I come from a background of working at grass-roots level in the voluntary sector and my experience has been ...
Vijay Patel:
I am not sure how it will work. BEMIS has a function, because our role is to enable our community groups to know what is happening and how to start influenci...
Cathy Peattie:
Lab
I want to know how people at local level will benefit from that. How do we ensure that what the Executive is saying—and the Executive's comments have been ve...
Vijay Patel:
It is very hard to implement at local level, because, as yet, there is no infrastructure. There are mechanisms for consultation with certain groups of people...
Mr McMahon:
Lab
I am concerned about the difference between providing the legislation and the framework and providing the training that is necessary to enable things to happ...
Vijay Patel:
Traditionally, the view has been that no one in Scotland knows enough about race relations, so it is better to import someone from England, but I know from m...
Mr Gil Paterson (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
A body that employs more than 150 full-time staff will be subject to further duties, including monitoring the number of staff who receive training and who ar...
Vijay Patel:
I do not know the employment statistics for Scotland. I suspect that setting the level at 150 employees will mean that most employers will fall below the thr...
Mr Paterson:
SNP
Do you acknowledge the need for a threshold? Do you think that it is too high or should there be no threshold at all?
Vijay Patel:
The threshold is too high. It must be realistic and pragmatic. We cannot expect all services to start implementing the provisions, because the voluntary sect...
Mr Paterson:
SNP
Yes.
Vijay Patel:
There are other mechanisms. If we rely on the Race Relations (Amendment) Act 2000, we will be in trouble. We have relied on one act and on one body for 25 ye...
Mr Paterson:
SNP
Do you think that bodies that do not meet the 150 full-time employee threshold will introduce similarly rigorous measures within their professions?
Vijay Patel:
Yes, I think that some bodies will introduce a threshold voluntarily, because they know that they are committed to the act.A minority of organisations in Sco...
Mr Paterson:
SNP
Are you convinced that the Commission for Racial Equality is suitable as the sole body to enforce the duty to promote racial equality? If not, what would you...
Vijay Patel:
That is a tough question. I will try to be diplomatic. As I said earlier, the CRE has been the sole organisation that is required to raise the issue. That sh...
Mr Paterson:
SNP
Yes, it was excellent. I might have another question later.
Cathy Peattie:
Lab
Educational bodies have been asked to publish the results of their monitoring annually. Is that approach to monitoring adequate? If not, how can we monitor r...
Vijay Patel:
Under the legislation, monitoring is limited to employment, which is not good enough and does not tell us about equality of service provision. When we talk a...
Cathy Peattie:
Lab
I agree that there should be wider monitoring in education. Her Majesty's Inspectorate of Education inspects local authority education departments as well as...