Chamber
Plenary, 07 Oct 2009
07 Oct 2009 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Rural Housing
I suppose that I should continue the theme of midwifery, which Liam McArthur began. My participation in the inquiry began in Aviemore in 2007 and continued with an interesting study visit to East Lothian and a committee meeting in Melrose just before I went on maternity leave in September 2008. I returned in April to find that the report was still being written. Now that's what I call an inquiry.
As the convener of the committee said, the inquiry began in very different economic conditions from those in which it finished, but the key issues remain the same. How do we ensure the supply of affordable housing, both to buy and to rent, in rural Scotland?
The committee faced the issue of the availability of affordable housing to rent time and again as we went round Scotland. There are different pressures in different parts of Scotland. The pressures in East Lothian are different from those on Arran, not least because the location of East Lothian in Edinburgh's commuter belt has influenced the supply of housing there. However, one thing that is common to all parts is that demand invariably outstrips supply.
As the inquiry continued, one of the real tensions that we faced was that of housing allocation policy, which is a difficult issue. Whether real or imagined, the perception exists that homelessness legislation discriminates against people who have been brought up in a community and who want to get a house of their own, maybe to move out of the family home, but are unable to reach the top of the list within a timescale that is acceptable to them. We also heard of cases in which older people wanted to move from the larger home that they lived in when their children were there to a smaller home but, again, the legislation did not allow that to happen easily. I know from the many examples in my case load that that is as true in Clydesdale as it is in other parts of Scotland. I am sure that all members have similar cases.
I certainly do not want to do anything that flies in the face of our tackling homelessness, but if we are serious about ensuring that rural communities are sustainable, we must find ways to enable people to find their way into the social rented sector. I hope that the minister will begin to look at that as the housing bill is developed.
The difficulty of developing sustainable rural communities is also compounded by developers' apparent unwillingness to build genuinely affordable housing in rural Scotland. With average earnings in Scotland being below those in other parts of the country, is it not perverse that most houses that we found being built during the inquiry were too big and too expensive to be affordable to the people who work in rural Scotland? When we quizzed the developers about that, it was everybody's fault but theirs and they made various excuses. They blamed local authorities and said that the authorities had openly discouraged the development of affordable housing to buy, although they could not come up with the evidence to support that allegation.
The truth is that the reason was greed. The larger house could be sold and the developer would get more for it and make more profit, so why bother building a two-bedroomed, £75,000 house that the man who works in the wee farm down the road or the woman who works in the factory might actually be able to afford?
What then happens is that bought housing becomes the preserve of the rich, who do not want anyone else to live in the nice housing area in which they have just bought. That builds up resentment in the local community and leads to difficulties when more housing is planned. As the housing market picks up, I hope that developers will learn from mistakes that have been made in the past. I hope that we will build genuinely mixed communities in which people who earn an average wage in Scotland can get a mortgage to buy a house that they can afford in the long term and not just in the good times, so that where they live is where they can stay.
On the proposed changes to the HAG, back-bench members from across the chamber accept that there is a problem. Liam McArthur's examples are not unique to Orkney, but are reflected throughout rural Scotland. Indeed, in my constituency of Clydesdale, RSLs that operate there are finding it increasingly difficult to make new projects stack up at a time when demand is increasing. I am sure that the minister does not have his eyes closed—I know from him and his record what he is about. He does not want to stifle the ability of rural RSLs to meet the needs of the communities that they serve. I hope that he will come back to the committee at some point in the future with a review of the situation, and that he will provide a more positive framework for the future.
Finally, I will deal quickly with how we use compulsory purchase, but perhaps from a slightly different angle. We find in some parts of rural Scotland that land and dwellings are being allowed to fall into disrepair because the owner either simply does not care, or is holding out for a better day. Some communities have to live with the blight of buildings that are falling down round about them, but which could provide housing for people who want it. That is certainly true in communities such as Carnwath and Rigside in my constituency, where there are such buildings. I ask the minister to look with his colleagues at how that situation could be better dealt with and how better advice can be given to local authorities on how they can use their compulsory purchase powers, and to RSLs to ensure that such sites can be developed for the benefit of communities, rather than their just being a blight on development and on the community and, perhaps, stopping other developers working in and around the area because of the landscape that they find on first inspection.
With those comments, I commend the report to the chamber and hope that members will vote for the motion at decision time.
As the convener of the committee said, the inquiry began in very different economic conditions from those in which it finished, but the key issues remain the same. How do we ensure the supply of affordable housing, both to buy and to rent, in rural Scotland?
The committee faced the issue of the availability of affordable housing to rent time and again as we went round Scotland. There are different pressures in different parts of Scotland. The pressures in East Lothian are different from those on Arran, not least because the location of East Lothian in Edinburgh's commuter belt has influenced the supply of housing there. However, one thing that is common to all parts is that demand invariably outstrips supply.
As the inquiry continued, one of the real tensions that we faced was that of housing allocation policy, which is a difficult issue. Whether real or imagined, the perception exists that homelessness legislation discriminates against people who have been brought up in a community and who want to get a house of their own, maybe to move out of the family home, but are unable to reach the top of the list within a timescale that is acceptable to them. We also heard of cases in which older people wanted to move from the larger home that they lived in when their children were there to a smaller home but, again, the legislation did not allow that to happen easily. I know from the many examples in my case load that that is as true in Clydesdale as it is in other parts of Scotland. I am sure that all members have similar cases.
I certainly do not want to do anything that flies in the face of our tackling homelessness, but if we are serious about ensuring that rural communities are sustainable, we must find ways to enable people to find their way into the social rented sector. I hope that the minister will begin to look at that as the housing bill is developed.
The difficulty of developing sustainable rural communities is also compounded by developers' apparent unwillingness to build genuinely affordable housing in rural Scotland. With average earnings in Scotland being below those in other parts of the country, is it not perverse that most houses that we found being built during the inquiry were too big and too expensive to be affordable to the people who work in rural Scotland? When we quizzed the developers about that, it was everybody's fault but theirs and they made various excuses. They blamed local authorities and said that the authorities had openly discouraged the development of affordable housing to buy, although they could not come up with the evidence to support that allegation.
The truth is that the reason was greed. The larger house could be sold and the developer would get more for it and make more profit, so why bother building a two-bedroomed, £75,000 house that the man who works in the wee farm down the road or the woman who works in the factory might actually be able to afford?
What then happens is that bought housing becomes the preserve of the rich, who do not want anyone else to live in the nice housing area in which they have just bought. That builds up resentment in the local community and leads to difficulties when more housing is planned. As the housing market picks up, I hope that developers will learn from mistakes that have been made in the past. I hope that we will build genuinely mixed communities in which people who earn an average wage in Scotland can get a mortgage to buy a house that they can afford in the long term and not just in the good times, so that where they live is where they can stay.
On the proposed changes to the HAG, back-bench members from across the chamber accept that there is a problem. Liam McArthur's examples are not unique to Orkney, but are reflected throughout rural Scotland. Indeed, in my constituency of Clydesdale, RSLs that operate there are finding it increasingly difficult to make new projects stack up at a time when demand is increasing. I am sure that the minister does not have his eyes closed—I know from him and his record what he is about. He does not want to stifle the ability of rural RSLs to meet the needs of the communities that they serve. I hope that he will come back to the committee at some point in the future with a review of the situation, and that he will provide a more positive framework for the future.
Finally, I will deal quickly with how we use compulsory purchase, but perhaps from a slightly different angle. We find in some parts of rural Scotland that land and dwellings are being allowed to fall into disrepair because the owner either simply does not care, or is holding out for a better day. Some communities have to live with the blight of buildings that are falling down round about them, but which could provide housing for people who want it. That is certainly true in communities such as Carnwath and Rigside in my constituency, where there are such buildings. I ask the minister to look with his colleagues at how that situation could be better dealt with and how better advice can be given to local authorities on how they can use their compulsory purchase powers, and to RSLs to ensure that such sites can be developed for the benefit of communities, rather than their just being a blight on development and on the community and, perhaps, stopping other developers working in and around the area because of the landscape that they find on first inspection.
With those comments, I commend the report to the chamber and hope that members will vote for the motion at decision time.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson):
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-4973, in the name of Maureen Watt, on the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee's report on rural housi...
Maureen Watt (North East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I am very pleased to open the debate on the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee's report on rural housing, and pleased that the whole Parliament has the ...
That the Parliament notes the conclusions and recommendations contained in the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee’s 5th Report, 2009 (Session 3):
Rural Housing (SP Paper 256).
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
Just before I call the minister, I point out that we can be a little flexible with time and can add on time taken for interventions. Had you insisted, conven...
The Minister for Housing and Communities (Alex Neil):
SNP
After your comments, Presiding Officer, I thought that I was going to have to restrict my comments to an hour.I congratulate the committee on producing a rep...
Mary Mulligan (Linlithgow) (Lab):
Lab
I am interested in the minister's comments about the European Investment Bank. Can he say at this stage what interest rates housing associations are likely t...
Alex Neil:
SNP
Both the payback period and the general terms and conditions are attractive compared with loans in the private sector. At the moment, the loan rate is 2 per ...
Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD):
LD
The minister gave way to me without my saying a word—I thank him for that. He makes an interesting point about the private sector. Further to that point, wha...
Alex Neil:
SNP
We are actively looking at all the options, including use of the bond market to fund housing, as there are limitations even on the use of local authorities' ...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con):
Con
Can the minister give a guarantee that the value at a later date will be higher?
Alex Neil:
SNP
Given that there might be a change of Government, I cannot give a guarantee on anything, particularly in relation to the economy. I am not foolish enough to ...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
You will get another chance, minister.
Peter Peacock (Highlands and Islands) (Lab):
Lab
It is my pleasure to open the debate for the Labour Party. My only qualification for this temporary return to the front bench is my being the only Labour mem...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman):
Lab
You owe me one, Mr Peacock.
Nanette Milne (North East Scotland) (Con):
Con
I have enjoyed ownership for the past 24 years of a modest second home in a rural Aberdeenshire settlement, but my house has not been in demand as a full-tim...
Liam McArthur (Orkney) (LD):
LD
On that point, does the member accept that a number of housing associations are concerned about the availability of detailed technical expertise in the energ...
Nanette Milne:
Con
I agree with Mr McArthur's valid comment, and I hope that the Government will pay heed to it.If energy-efficiency advances were made, we would have better an...
Liam McArthur (Orkney) (LD):
LD
I welcome today's debate. Like previous speakers, I believe that few issues currently facing rural Scotland are more significant than the lack of sufficient,...
Bill Wilson (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
The issue of housing is complex and contentious. There are economic, fiscal, environmental and transport issues to consider, as well as many fraught issues, ...
Elaine Murray (Dumfries) (Lab):
Lab
I became a member of the Rural Affairs and Environment Committee on 8 October last year and attended only the final two evidence sessions of the inquiry. The...
Rob Gibson (Highlands and Islands) (SNP):
SNP
I can inform members of the prequel to this discussion, which took place when Richard Lochhead and I were on the Environment and Rural Development Committee ...
Karen Gillon (Clydesdale) (Lab):
Lab
I suppose that I should continue the theme of midwifery, which Liam McArthur began. My participation in the inquiry began in Aviemore in 2007 and continued w...
Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I recognise very much the picture that Karen Gillon painted and I might touch on many of the same points.When I first came to the Parliament 10 years ago, mo...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
I apologise to the convener and the minister for missing the convener's speech and the first part of the minister's speech. The debate broadly reflects the r...
Aileen Campbell (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
Everyone agrees that today's debate has been a useful opportunity to examine in the round some of the challenges and possible options for the future that fac...
Rhoda Grant (Highlands and Islands) (Lab):
Lab
Presiding Officer, I am grateful that you have allowed me to contribute to the debate, despite my absence for part of it; I also apologise to members who spo...
Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD):
LD
I read the report and I acknowledge the thorough and thoughtful input that went into it.The debate will greatly hearten everyone who cares about housing in r...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con):
Con
I am pleased to wind up for the Conservatives in a debate that, for the most part, has been constructive and useful. Like other speakers, I pay tribute to th...
Jamie Stone:
LD
I accept the point that the member makes. Does he agree that one reason why landowners may not be engaging with the scheme is that the tax regime governing t...
Jamie McGrigor:
Con
I do not know whether the member means the tax regime for developers, builders or what, but I am happy to discuss that with him afterwards.The Government nee...