Chamber
Plenary, 09 Oct 2008
09 Oct 2008 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
<br />Secure Accommodation
I thank the minister for the advance copy of his statement.
We agree that it is vital that the secure accommodation estate is fit for purpose and that the right lessons are learned from the events of March this year at St Mary's Kenmure. There are lessons for communities, for staff—some of whom, unfortunately, were the victims of assault—and for young people who are in secure accommodation either because they are vulnerable or because their behaviour needs to be addressed effectively. Can the minister assure us that Parliament will be able to debate fully the recommendations of the working group on secure accommodation that he has asked to report by spring?
Given that the report on St Mary's highlights capacity issues and the relationship between staff and local police, will the working group focus on how effective joint working might be achieved to ensure the smooth running of the estate? Will ministers continue to be involved in securing that?
If unruly certificates are abolished, might that not be expected to lead to greater demand for places in secure accommodation? In that context, does the minister agree that it would be short-sighted to reduce capacity in the estate? If the proposal goes ahead, what contingencies will be put in place for the few young people who are dealt with in that part of the system because their behaviour is simply too challenging or poses too serious a risk to themselves or others for them to be handled within the community or within secure accommodation?
Finally, although the report focuses on what was a troubling and disturbing incident, the minister also mentioned the need to celebrate good work. How will the Scottish Government ensure that the excellent practice that takes place in secure accommodation is shared across the estate, particularly through staff training?
We agree that it is vital that the secure accommodation estate is fit for purpose and that the right lessons are learned from the events of March this year at St Mary's Kenmure. There are lessons for communities, for staff—some of whom, unfortunately, were the victims of assault—and for young people who are in secure accommodation either because they are vulnerable or because their behaviour needs to be addressed effectively. Can the minister assure us that Parliament will be able to debate fully the recommendations of the working group on secure accommodation that he has asked to report by spring?
Given that the report on St Mary's highlights capacity issues and the relationship between staff and local police, will the working group focus on how effective joint working might be achieved to ensure the smooth running of the estate? Will ministers continue to be involved in securing that?
If unruly certificates are abolished, might that not be expected to lead to greater demand for places in secure accommodation? In that context, does the minister agree that it would be short-sighted to reduce capacity in the estate? If the proposal goes ahead, what contingencies will be put in place for the few young people who are dealt with in that part of the system because their behaviour is simply too challenging or poses too serious a risk to themselves or others for them to be handled within the community or within secure accommodation?
Finally, although the report focuses on what was a troubling and disturbing incident, the minister also mentioned the need to celebrate good work. How will the Scottish Government ensure that the excellent practice that takes place in secure accommodation is shared across the estate, particularly through staff training?
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan):
SNP
The next item of business is a statement by Fergus Ewing on strengthening Scotland's secure accommodation. The minister will take questions at the end of his...
The Minister for Community Safety (Fergus Ewing):
SNP
I very much welcome the opportunity to tell members about the work that we are doing to improve the effectiveness of secure accommodation in Scotland. I will...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
The minister will take questions on the issues raised in his statement. I intend to allow around 30 minutes for questions.
Richard Baker (North East Scotland) (Lab):
Lab
I thank the minister for the advance copy of his statement.We agree that it is vital that the secure accommodation estate is fit for purpose and that the rig...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I welcome Richard Baker's general approach to the issue. I will try to answer as best I can each of his questions in turn.First, it seems to us entirely reas...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con):
Con
I thank the minister for early sight of his statement, which I find to be measured and realistic, in contrast to some of the statements that he made earlier ...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
The secure units are considerably aware of the need to treat separately youngsters who are in secure units for different reasons. When I visited the new, ult...
Robert Brown (Glasgow) (LD):
LD
I, too, welcome much of what the minister said in his statement—with the possible exception of the addition to the language of two new acronyms, which we cou...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
We intend to introduce the criminal justice bill next year, through which we will abolish unruly certificates.I fully agree that Kibble provides many facilit...
Joe FitzPatrick (Dundee West) (SNP):
SNP
When I visited the Elms in Dundee, I was incredibly impressed by the commitment and dedication of the staff. Secure units such as the Elms have an important ...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I join Joe FitzPatrick in acknowledging the work that is carried out by the Elms in Dundee. I believe that it caters for boys and girls and that it is manage...
Paul Martin (Glasgow Springburn) (Lab):
Lab
I concur with the minister's consensual vision of how we can take secure accommodation forward. However, I would like him to assure us that the resources tha...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I can provide an assurance that we want to continue to see the funding of those places. Part of the funding is from the Scottish Government and part is from ...
John Wilson (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I welcome the minister's statement, particularly his reference to the incident at St Mary's at the beginning of the year. What discussions are taking place a...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I should say that St Mary's operated for 32 years without incident and received extremely positive reports. The staff there have done an excellent job. Probl...
David Whitton (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the minister's statement, particularly as Mr Ewing's boss, Mr MacAskill, wrote to me on 17 September to say that he did not think that a statement ...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I am pleased to have made my statement. It was right to make one today, and members have welcomed it.Mr Whitton and I met St Mary's managers, and had a thoro...
Jackson Carlaw (West of Scotland) (Con):
Con
We are all relieved that the actions that the St Mary's board of management has taken have resolved the crisis of earlier this year. However, I want to press...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
Plainly, the incident at St Mary's was unique. The member appears to suggest that other incidents of young people absconding from secure units have occurred ...
Mike Pringle (Edinburgh South) (LD):
LD
The minister is concerned about overcapacity. Can he give the Parliament a flavour of that? What was the level of underoccupancy at the last count, and is it...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I stress that youngsters are sent to secure units only as a very last resort. No youngster is sent there unless other options have been considered and tried....
Christina McKelvie (Central Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I am sure that every member welcomes the minister's commitment to the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child. Will he seek to write the convent...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
We certainly respect and acknowledge the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child, and we wish to ensure that the practical imports of its provisions are ful...
Karen Whitefield (Airdrie and Shotts) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the minister's acknowledgement that, because of overcapacity in the system, there are serious issues in relation to the future of secure accommodat...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
I can share details of SOFI's membership with members. I thought that it was publicly available anyway, but I will ensure that the Scottish Parliament inform...
Gil Paterson (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I lived directly opposite the St Mary's unit in Bishopbriggs for a number of years, and I had the experience of dealing with some of the young people from th...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
Does the member have a question?
Gil Paterson:
SNP
I have a question.Will the minister examine the use of intensive support and monitoring services? That would benefit some young people, such as those whom I ...
Fergus Ewing:
SNP
Intensive support and monitoring services were introduced in 2004, as an alternative to secure accommodation for young people aged between 12 and 17 who are ...