Chamber
Plenary, 12 Jun 2008
12 Jun 2008 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Expenses Scheme
I will try to keep my speech brief. I speak in support of Tricia Marwick's amendment, but I approve of and support the vast majority of what Tom McCabe said. The Langlands report and the work that went into it are very valuable to Parliament.
Many members have approached me over the period of the review and consideration of it to make representations on subjects such as the Edinburgh accommodation allowance and the mileage payable, and I have had to tell them that I support the independent view of the report, because it was reached by an independent panel.
However, I will support the amendment in the name of Tricia Marwick and I speak because of the issue of equity. I believe that equality of esteem for members is a key principle that we must continue to support. Although people like me were opposed to the principle of proportional representation—and continue to oppose it for other reasons—the fact that members of this Parliament are elected proportionally to the votes that are cast is something of which we should be proud. The fact that we all draw the same salary and have similarly comfortable seats should not be the limit of our equality. I genuinely fear that if we are to accept a principle that will allow certain members to claim more office and staff support than others, the principle of proportional representation will, in effect, have been breached. Therefore, I stand to defend the principle of equity.
I am disappointed that the figure that we have come to is the one that is mentioned in Tricia Marwick's amendment. However, given that I am a member of the corporate body, affordability must always be one of my responsibilities. Therefore, I believe that the only option that was left to us was to take the figures for staff allowances that had been recommended by the Langlands report and to average them in order to achieve equity.
Many members have approached me over the period of the review and consideration of it to make representations on subjects such as the Edinburgh accommodation allowance and the mileage payable, and I have had to tell them that I support the independent view of the report, because it was reached by an independent panel.
However, I will support the amendment in the name of Tricia Marwick and I speak because of the issue of equity. I believe that equality of esteem for members is a key principle that we must continue to support. Although people like me were opposed to the principle of proportional representation—and continue to oppose it for other reasons—the fact that members of this Parliament are elected proportionally to the votes that are cast is something of which we should be proud. The fact that we all draw the same salary and have similarly comfortable seats should not be the limit of our equality. I genuinely fear that if we are to accept a principle that will allow certain members to claim more office and staff support than others, the principle of proportional representation will, in effect, have been breached. Therefore, I stand to defend the principle of equity.
I am disappointed that the figure that we have come to is the one that is mentioned in Tricia Marwick's amendment. However, given that I am a member of the corporate body, affordability must always be one of my responsibilities. Therefore, I believe that the only option that was left to us was to take the figures for staff allowances that had been recommended by the Langlands report and to average them in order to achieve equity.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson):
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-2092, in the name of Tom McCabe, on the expenses scheme.
Tom McCabe (Hamilton South) (Lab):
Lab
I rise, on behalf of the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body, to speak to the recommendations of an independent review panel on members' expenses.In light ...
Tricia Marwick (Central Fife) (SNP):
SNP
I record my thanks for the work of Sir Alan Langlands and the other members of the review panel, who presented us with a comprehensive report on a proposed n...
Cathie Craigie (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (Lab):
Lab
Will the member give way?
Tricia Marwick:
SNP
I have very little time.It is worth recording that every member of the SPCB agreed that the Langlands report used figures at the 2007-08 level and that all f...
Michael McMahon (Hamilton North and Bellshill) (Lab):
Lab
Lyndon B Johnson once said:"You've got to work things out in the cloakroom. When you've got them worked out, you can debate a little before you vote."Today, ...
George Foulkes (Lothians) (Lab):
Lab
Does the member agree that the study that was carried out on behalf of the Langlands committee did not examine a representative sample of regional and consti...
Michael McMahon:
Lab
I agree with that. I was coming to that point.The point that has been made about parity is the same as arguing that a head of history and a head of physical ...
Gil Paterson (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
United we stand.
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
We do not need sedentary interventions between speeches, thank you.
Margo MacDonald (Lothians) (Ind):
Ind
I add my thanks to those that have already been recorded for the work that was done by the Langlands committee. My amendments rest on two propositions. The f...
Cathie Craigie:
Lab
Will the member give way?
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
I will establish the point and come back to the member.I agree completely with the report's identification of Sarah Boyack's office as the quality benchmark ...
Cathie Craigie:
Lab
Margo MacDonald says that the public do not care about the way in which members are elected. I suspect that she might be right in a way, but the fact is that...
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
With all due respect to the member, I do not think that that point is proved.In list members' offices, which have proportionately lower numbers of individual...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab):
Lab
My amendment does not seek to deny our staff appropriate salaries. Does Margo MacDonald therefore regret that the SPCB removed any reference to pay scales fo...
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
On the first point, I could not agree more: there should be salary scales. On the second point, I feel that the principle is either accepted or rejected. I r...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
In closing, Ms MacDonald.
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
I feel that islands MSPs are particularly hard done to. I urge all my fellow members not to vote on party-political grounds. They should think of this as a P...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con):
Con
I will try to keep my speech brief. I speak in support of Tricia Marwick's amendment, but I approve of and support the vast majority of what Tom McCabe said....
Margaret Smith (Edinburgh West) (LD):
LD
Will the member take an intervention?
Alex Johnstone:
Con
No, thank you.The many members who have made representations on the need to ensure adequate office support have made good cases.Finally, I want to express an...
Ross Finnie (West of Scotland) (LD):
LD
I speak in a personal capacity. The Liberal Democrats believe that this is an important matter for Parliament to decide, so we will have a free vote.I will c...
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
Will the member give way?
Cathie Craigie:
Lab
Will the member give way?
Ross Finnie:
LD
Let me make this point. I do not doubt for a moment that casework is, or could be, an issue, but I find it incredible that the review panel found no other ma...
Cathie Craigie:
Lab
I accept that the inquiry was missing detailed information on that point, but I can give Ross Finnie an example. "The Code of Conduct for Members of the Scot...
Ross Finnie:
LD
I am sorry that Cathie Craigie is not listening. I have not disputed that casework is an issue; I am saying that casework is not the only issue in comparing ...
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
Will the member give way?
Ross Finnie:
LD
No.I thought that that was the review panel's remit, but it does not explain why, if it was so deficient in evidence, it did not pause for reflection and cal...