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Chamber

Plenary, 23 Apr 2008

23 Apr 2008 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Historic Scotland and Local Authorities
Brocklebank, Ted Con Mid Scotland and Fife Watch on SPTV
I am a fan of Historic Scotland, although there are aspects of its operation with which I disagree, to which I will return. I continue to believe that the agency is underfunded, as it was by the previous Executive. However, it generally does a good job in preserving Scotland's unique historical environment. I welcome the £8 million in funding that the minister has announced today.

Of course, Historic Scotland is not perfect. Arguably, the adjective "historic" has become somewhat debased through its overuse by the First Minister—if I never again hear the phrase "historic concordat" it will be too soon. A review of Historic Scotland that the Executive carried out in 2004 concluded that there was a clear need for a culture change in the agency. Perhaps a name change would also help. I welcome the minister's assurances that a culture change is well under way. Nevertheless, given some of the on-going cases, to which I will refer later, I hae some doots.

Scots have never been more fascinated by the events that shaped the nation's history, both since the union of 1707 and going back to the time when the land of the Scots first emerged in the fallout between the feuding Picts, the Celts and Athelstane's west Saxons. Equally, television has never been more fascinated with Scottish history, and it is fitting that universities such as the University of Abertay Dundee are now world leaders in providing the computer graphics that help to bring history alive. The welcome TV coverage has helped to revitalise the tourism industry, as we have heard from Malcolm Chisholm, with historical buildings in particular attracting record numbers in the past year. Edinburgh and Stirling castles still lead the way. However, according to Historic Scotland, Corgarff castle in Aberdeenshire and Kisimul castle in Barra are among the 300 buildings in its care that have had huge increases in their visitor numbers over the past year, which is to be welcomed.

Although Historic Scotland and the National Trust for Scotland, which it often works in conjunction with, have saved many of our most venerable and vulnerable buildings and sites, there are buildings all over Scotland on the at-risk register—many of them listed—that are simply crumbling away. Largo house, an impressive Adam pile in my part of Fife, is one such building. The usual argument from Historic Scotland and the Scottish Civic Trust, which holds the at-risk register, is that there is a lack of funds, and there is justification for that claim. The agency's grant from the SNP has increased by some 8 per cent this year, but as far as I can judge it is due to dip again next year to below the level under the previous Executive in real terms.

Although we should praise aspects of Historic Scotland's role, we should also recognise the role of private landowners who have played a major part in preserving our cultural and historical heritage. In this connection, Historic Scotland must be sensible about working with proprietors to achieve agreement, particularly over contested sites or buildings, and where it has no realistic way of finding the necessary finance to achieve the degree of preservation that it often seeks to dictate.

In 2003, after a battle lasting nearly a decade, Alistair Dickson bulldozed Lanrick castle, a ruinous, B-listed Victorian edifice near Doune, which he owned. Historic Scotland and the Scottish Civic Trust were unable to contribute funds to the building's upkeep, but they insisted that the owner pay to prevent it from becoming a public danger. Mr Dickson was fined £1,000 for pulling it down. No one condones breaking the law, but it is hard not to disagree with the sheriff who criticised Stirling Council for being inept in ordering the owner to make the ruins safe while simultaneously informing him that he would need listed building consent, which might take months, before he could take the required action. Sheriff Wylie Robertson accurately described it as "bureaucratic nonsense".

A similar bureaucratic nonsense exists at Crawford priory near Cupar in Fife. Negotiations have been going on with Historic Scotland for nearly four decades. The priory is another ruinous, B-listed building that Historic Scotland will not allow the owner to pull down. Because of a lack of commitment to provide funding, the building has become a ruin and a public hazard.

I referred to yet another bureaucratic nonsense—the case of the second world war airfield, HMS Jackdaw, at Crail in Fife—in a question to the minister last week. Historic Scotland says that it is the best-preserved world war two airfield in Scotland, despite the fact that it played no role in world war two and it has been lying derelict for decades. The owner has, in effect, been prevented from farming or developing his own land since the listing was granted a decade ago. In the view of even the most conservation-minded, it must be tempting to say that Historic Scotland should put up or shut up.

At a time when we are told that Historic Scotland is undergoing a major culture change, it is depressing that the Kilrymont annexe to Madras college in St Andrews, which was built in 1967 along the dreary lines of similar Fife educational establishments, cannot be bulldozed to allow Madras college to move to a long-overdue single-site school without obtaining listed building consent, because Kilrymont's allegedly striking pagoda roof is B-listed.

In previous debates on this subject, I have referred to Castle Tioram on the Ardnamurchan peninsula—a listing absurdity that I will not reprise on this occasion. However, Historic Scotland has guardianship over several similar ruins that are kept as a result of what I can only describe as genteel necrophilia. They are lovingly sustained skeletons of structures that could be restored and made to earn their keep as living buildings again.

We welcome the minister's assurances about the streamlining of Historic Scotland. Let us hope that it will mean fewer grand strategies, less defending of the indefensible, and more genuine community, public and stakeholder involvement.

I move amendment S3M-1751.1, to insert at end:

"and seeks a more compatible approach in relation to resolving disputes with stakeholders, particularly where Historic Scotland has no realistic means of funding its desired preservation or conservation outcomes".

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson): NPA
The next item of business is a debate on S3M-1751, in the name of Linda Fabiani, on Historic Scotland and local authorities.
The Minister for Europe, External Affairs and Culture (Linda Fabiani): SNP
I am pleased to open the debate, which allows me to highlight the many ways in which central and local government are working together to deliver a sustainab...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab): Lab
I welcome the announcement of the £8 million to continue the work of the conservation area regeneration scheme, and the key performance targets for planning ...
Ted Brocklebank (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con): Con
I am a fan of Historic Scotland, although there are aspects of its operation with which I disagree, to which I will return. I continue to believe that the ag...
Iain Smith (North East Fife) (LD): LD
I welcome this rare opportunity to focus on the role of Historic Scotland. At one point, I was concerned about whether there would be a ministerial statement...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman): Lab
We move to the debate. Speeches should be of six minutes.
Rob Gibson (Highlands and Islands) (SNP): SNP
I very much welcome this opportunity to explore the co-operation between Historic Scotland and local authorities, which the minister has enhanced today with ...
James Kelly (Glasgow Rutherglen) (Lab): Lab
I welcome this debate on Historic Scotland and its joint working with local authorities, because we should discuss its role in administering Scotland's histo...
John Farquhar Munro (Ross, Skye and Inverness West) (LD): LD
I am pleased to take part in a debate during which we have heard about numerous anomalies and difficulties relating to the work of our colleagues in Historic...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con): Con
You alluded to Eilean Donan castle as having been a pile of rocks, but I remind you that it was under your party's Administration that Castle Tioram remained...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan): SNP
That did not happen under my party's Administration.
John Farquhar Munro: LD
I do not think that the issue was ever debated seriously in the Scottish Parliament, because it was simply a planning matter between Highland Council and His...
Christopher Harvie (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP): SNP
I thank John Farquhar Munro for reminding us that one of Scotland's iconic structures dates from only about 70 years ago, thus depriving us of any historical...
Helen Eadie (Dunfermline East) (Lab): Lab
There is no doubt that the conservation and reuse of buildings must rank highly in terms of sustainability. Ensuring that restoration is sympathetic is a cru...
Willie Coffey (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (SNP): SNP
I start with a declaration of interest. Like many in the chamber, as a member of a local authority I have been involved in planning issues for a number of ye...
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill) (Lab): Lab
I declare an interest as a member of Historic Scotland.As others have said, our distinctive environment has been formed by centuries of activity by nature an...
Liam McArthur (Orkney) (LD): LD
Like Patricia Ferguson and Willie Coffey, I declare an interest as a member of Historic Scotland. As a result of that membership, I have sons who have a heal...
The Deputy Presiding Officer: SNP
The member has one minute left.
Liam McArthur: LD
In my constituency I know of situations in which there has been a complete failure to communicate properly or to engage with local stakeholders. Although I f...
The Deputy Presiding Officer: SNP
The member must conclude now.
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con): Con
I am pleased to speak in the debate, which has been very informative. In 2004, during a similar debate, I made a speech that was partially critical of Histor...
Malcolm Chisholm: Lab
I am happy to support Iain Smith's amendment, with its emphasis on effective engagement with local communities in relation to listed buildings. More generall...
Linda Fabiani: SNP
The most sensible thing that I have heard Malcolm Chisholm say today is that I will not have enough time. He is right: in the eight minutes that are availabl...