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Chamber

Plenary, 23 Apr 2008

23 Apr 2008 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Historic Scotland and Local Authorities
I am pleased to open the debate, which allows me to highlight the many ways in which central and local government are working together to deliver a sustainable future for Scotland's historic environment.

That historic environment is hugely significant to Scotland, not as a museum piece, but as a dynamic evolving resource whose future relies on carefully managed change that is based on an understanding of its specialist qualities. We recognise its importance as heritage in its own right and for tourism, but it also contributes to sustainability, place making, community identity, local distinctiveness and, of course, employment. It can be sustained only by a broad partnership of owners, Government and business working together to secure its future.

Central to that partnership is the relationship between Historic Scotland, as the national agency that is responsible for the historic environment, and local authorities, which have a broader role in relation to development planning, economic development, culture and education. That close relationship is exemplified in many ways throughout the country, in particular by one of Historic Scotland's major recent initiatives: the creation of the conservation area regeneration scheme. Under the previous Administration, £8 million was allocated for that scheme, with moneys to be released between 2007 and 2012. That fund provides financial assistance for the area-based regeneration and conservation initiatives that local authorities undertake, principally in the historic centres of towns and burghs.

There was heavy demand for the scheme when it was launched, and 37 separate bids were made that totalled around £19 million. Historic Scotland is currently supporting 18 projects, including those in Stornoway, Kilmarnock, Bo'ness and Banff. The scheme has been a major success and many local authorities have said that they want it to continue. I am sure that colleagues from all parties will be delighted that I am able to announce that Historic Scotland has allocated up to £8 million for a further round of that very popular scheme, which will again be spent over five years. That funding will be targeted at councils that have not yet benefited, and at areas in which existing conservation projects can be enhanced with additional resources.

I am pleased to outline a number of other measures that will improve partnership working and benefit management of our historic environment, in response to points that were made by—among others—the Historic Environment Advisory Council for Scotland, in its 2006 report on the role of local government in the historic environment. We have concluded, as part of our commitment to streamlining the public sector, that HEACS does not need to be retained beyond its agreed work plan, which continues. However, the hard work of the council's individual members and the quality of its contribution to debates such as this is hugely appreciated, and I want to record my gratitude for its professionalism across the board.

Much of the joint working between local authorities and Historic Scotland flows from the agency's role in development planning and management. Local authorities have the opportunity to tap into the wealth of knowledge and experience within the agency, adding value to the wealth of knowledge and experience of their own specialist staff. However, as has been noted many times, there is scope for confusion about roles and overlap of activities.

Our historic environment is rich and varied. Rightly, we recognise the need to distinguish between what is best managed locally and what needs an element of national protection. Local authorities identify and manage a range of local designations, including heritage areas, archaeology sites and conservation areas, which are areas of local value that have a distinctive character that is important to the community. Historic Scotland is responsible on behalf of ministers for identifying parts of our historic environment that are of particular value at national level—notably for scheduling monuments such as the stone circle at Brodgar on Orkney and the listing of buildings such as Castlemilk stables in Glasgow, the recent renovation of which was partly funded by Historic Scotland.

Such designations are intended to help to manage change, not to prevent it. The management of change is largely administered by local authorities in their role as planning authorities. I am sure that Parliament will be pleased to learn that the agency's approach is developing rapidly. It aims to enable all partners to maximise their particular contributions.

We must protect our heritage while promoting growth and development. Central to that are the new joint working agreements that are being developed in response to demand from local authorities. The agreements will set out what is expected of each partner in relation to management of change in the historic environment. They are intended to allow issues to be dealt with as locally as possible and to ensure that Historic Scotland is involved only when it can add value: it should not replicate work that local authorities have already done. Initial discussions have been held between my officials and a number of local authorities, and the joint working agreements will be launched in May. Local authorities will be invited to sign up during the remainder of the year.

I am pleased to confirm that, when local authorities sign up to the joint working agreements, we will also be able to offer them the opportunity to acquire delegated powers to deal with listed-building casework, as is permitted under planning legislation. That approach has the potential to streamline the current process significantly without any threat to the historic environment. We plan to pilot such schemes with a small number of local authorities this year—the City of Edinburgh Council, Glasgow City Council and Perth and Kinross Council. I hope that the experience of those early enthusiasts will energise others to follow suit.

To support all that work and ensure efficient handling, Historic Scotland was included in the wider e-planning programme that the Government is promoting to allow much more to be done online. I am pleased that, this year, Historic Scotland will become fully integrated with the e-planning programme. If local authorities wish, they will be able to consult the agency more quickly and cheaply than previously, which will help to ensure that more planning applications meet the targets that ministers have set. In that context, I announce that I have agreed with Historic Scotland a new key performance target for dealing with planning consultation—70 per cent within 14 days this year, rising to 90 per cent in 2009-10. The agency already has a target of clearing 97 per cent of listed building consent notifications within 28 days. This year, it exceeded that. The new target shows that Historic Scotland is contributing to the Government's wider agenda through its continuing commitment to the development of a modern, streamlined planning system for Scotland.

The efficiencies that are created by those modernising initiatives will not be wasted. Instead, they will enable Historic Scotland to give strategic support to local authorities throughout Scotland in ways that are simply not possible at present. I firmly believe that the initiatives will contribute significantly to an even stronger relationship between Historic Scotland and local government.

Of course, there are many other ways in which local government and Historic Scotland work together, including management of properties in care. The agency has properties in care in every local authority area except East Renfrewshire. Its work therefore brings it into contact with local authorities in many ways, such as through formal partnerships, local liaison groups and other initiatives. There is also partnership work with groups that aim to improve access and develop tourism. For example, current initiatives include working to improve the Edinburgh castle tattoo and delivering interpretation in Kilmartin Glen in Argyll and Bute, and at Whithorn priory in Dumfries and Galloway, to name just a couple.

Partnership working happens on the world stage, too. Historic Scotland and Orkney Islands Council are co-signatories to the statement of intent for the heart of Neolithic Orkney world heritage site. The partners work closely to implement the management plan and arrange access to, and interpretation of, the sites.

I have outlined new initiatives today: an additional £8 million will go to the conservation area regeneration scheme; there will be a joint working agreement to detail the roles and responsibilities of Historic Scotland and local authorities; there is potential for delegated powers in listed building casework; and there are e-planning integration and the key performance targets. I hope that colleagues throughout the chamber will welcome those initiatives.

I will use my final minute to say a word about the amendments to the motion. I am pleased to accept the amendment in the name of Malcolm Chisholm. What it proposes will complement what everyone is trying to do to protect our heritage assets. The skills that are required to maintain historic buildings are hugely important. Work is continuing in that regard. In addition, we should take proper account of disability rights and climate change objectives.

Likewise, I am happy to accept the amendment that Iain Smith lodged on behalf of the Liberal Democrats. There are perceptions that Historic Scotland and local authorities sometimes do not work well enough together to ensure that everyone is informed of the work that they do. I am more than happy to consider that in order to try to improve consultation of local communities, where it is required, on designation of listed buildings and scheduled monuments.

Unfortunately, much as I would like to accept the amendment in the name of Ted Brocklebank, I am unable to do so. I understand that cases must often be considered on an individual basis, but I feel that what the second part of the amendment proposes would not be particularly helpful for the overall role of all who are concerned to protect our heritage.

I commend the motion to Parliament, and I am happy to accept the amendments in the name of Malcolm Chisholm and Iain Smith.

I move,

That the Parliament recognises the unique relationship between Historic Scotland and local authorities in the protection of the nation's historic environment and welcomes initiatives to modernise and simplify that relationship to the benefit of local authorities, Historic Scotland and stakeholders.

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson): NPA
The next item of business is a debate on S3M-1751, in the name of Linda Fabiani, on Historic Scotland and local authorities.
The Minister for Europe, External Affairs and Culture (Linda Fabiani): SNP
I am pleased to open the debate, which allows me to highlight the many ways in which central and local government are working together to deliver a sustainab...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab): Lab
I welcome the announcement of the £8 million to continue the work of the conservation area regeneration scheme, and the key performance targets for planning ...
Ted Brocklebank (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con): Con
I am a fan of Historic Scotland, although there are aspects of its operation with which I disagree, to which I will return. I continue to believe that the ag...
Iain Smith (North East Fife) (LD): LD
I welcome this rare opportunity to focus on the role of Historic Scotland. At one point, I was concerned about whether there would be a ministerial statement...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman): Lab
We move to the debate. Speeches should be of six minutes.
Rob Gibson (Highlands and Islands) (SNP): SNP
I very much welcome this opportunity to explore the co-operation between Historic Scotland and local authorities, which the minister has enhanced today with ...
James Kelly (Glasgow Rutherglen) (Lab): Lab
I welcome this debate on Historic Scotland and its joint working with local authorities, because we should discuss its role in administering Scotland's histo...
John Farquhar Munro (Ross, Skye and Inverness West) (LD): LD
I am pleased to take part in a debate during which we have heard about numerous anomalies and difficulties relating to the work of our colleagues in Historic...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con): Con
You alluded to Eilean Donan castle as having been a pile of rocks, but I remind you that it was under your party's Administration that Castle Tioram remained...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan): SNP
That did not happen under my party's Administration.
John Farquhar Munro: LD
I do not think that the issue was ever debated seriously in the Scottish Parliament, because it was simply a planning matter between Highland Council and His...
Christopher Harvie (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP): SNP
I thank John Farquhar Munro for reminding us that one of Scotland's iconic structures dates from only about 70 years ago, thus depriving us of any historical...
Helen Eadie (Dunfermline East) (Lab): Lab
There is no doubt that the conservation and reuse of buildings must rank highly in terms of sustainability. Ensuring that restoration is sympathetic is a cru...
Willie Coffey (Kilmarnock and Loudoun) (SNP): SNP
I start with a declaration of interest. Like many in the chamber, as a member of a local authority I have been involved in planning issues for a number of ye...
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill) (Lab): Lab
I declare an interest as a member of Historic Scotland.As others have said, our distinctive environment has been formed by centuries of activity by nature an...
Liam McArthur (Orkney) (LD): LD
Like Patricia Ferguson and Willie Coffey, I declare an interest as a member of Historic Scotland. As a result of that membership, I have sons who have a heal...
The Deputy Presiding Officer: SNP
The member has one minute left.
Liam McArthur: LD
In my constituency I know of situations in which there has been a complete failure to communicate properly or to engage with local stakeholders. Although I f...
The Deputy Presiding Officer: SNP
The member must conclude now.
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con): Con
I am pleased to speak in the debate, which has been very informative. In 2004, during a similar debate, I made a speech that was partially critical of Histor...
Malcolm Chisholm: Lab
I am happy to support Iain Smith's amendment, with its emphasis on effective engagement with local communities in relation to listed buildings. More generall...
Linda Fabiani: SNP
The most sensible thing that I have heard Malcolm Chisholm say today is that I will not have enough time. He is right: in the eight minutes that are availabl...