Chamber
Plenary, 27 Mar 2008
27 Mar 2008 · S3 · Plenary
Item of business
Fatal Accident Inquiries
Scotland is widely perceived to be a reasonably safe place to live and it is relied on as such. Whatever activity someone takes part in, be it white-water rafting, bungee jumping or simply a day at work, it has been fully risk assessed for any reasonable eventuality. If an accident occurs, we have committed emergency and health care professionals at hand to deal with problems. That comprehensive approach to safety means that when something goes tragically wrong it is often all the more inexplicable, so it is right to have in place a rigorous, reliable and efficient system to assess why the multitude of fallbacks and regulations failed.
Whether the current system meets the standard I have described is at best questionable. Michael McMahon gave us a good example of when families want an FAI and feel that they have been let down because no judicial inquiry has been undertaken. As several members have said, the Fatal Accidents and Sudden Deaths Inquiry (Scotland) Act was passed in 1976. Everybody agrees that, 30 years later, it looks old, tired and inefficient. I think that Michael Matheson made the good point that any future legislation should be flexible.
Angus Robertson MP perhaps summed up the situation best when, on the seventh of this month, he described the system as "beleaguered and backlogged". That statement formed part of his second claim of SNP action on the issue, further to his remarks of June last year, when he said that the new SNP Government had acted to ensure that the Scottish legal system played its part in investigating overseas military deaths.
I am pleased that Frank Mulholland has said that Lord Cullen's new review will report in a year and I agree entirely with Margaret Smith that the issue is extremely complex and that time needs to be taken to get it right, but will the cabinet secretary give us an idea of how soon after the inquiry concludes the Government will take action?
Several pertinent questions need to be asked before we move forward. For example, should the number of mandatory inquiries be greater? Could the system cope with more? Do we supply sufficient information to victims' families? Bill Aitken was right to say that families need more assistance with how to ask for an FAI—with what the system is, where to go and who to ask. Many families seem unaware that if they do not call for an FAI from the outset, they will not have a second chance to do so. For those reasons, I fully support the upcoming review.
I agree with the comments of Frank Mulholland, Margaret Smith and others about Lord Cullen. I am delighted that one of my constituents—a man who is well known in the legal profession, who has significant experience in public inquiries and who is a former Lord Justice General—has agreed to take on the review. I suggest that, for him, retirement has not lasted long. However, it is also important to examine what can be done now to speed up the process, particularly for inquiries into the deaths of service personnel.
Margaret Smith and others have comprehensively covered fatal accident inquiries in the military, so I will not go into the detail, but I offer my support to all those who spoke. Keith Brown made a telling speech that used his personal experience and he brought a personal perspective to the issue.
I regret to introduce slight discord into the debate, but I must ask whether the Scottish Labour Party supports the remarks of Des Browne, the UK Government's Secretary of State for Defence, who has called for strongly worded criticism of the Ministry of Defence to be outlawed from inquests into soldiers' deaths. Surely if an inquiry system is to function in any practical sense, it cannot be censored by any Government, any Government official or any Government minister. The fact that a senior UK Cabinet minister would suggest anything to the contrary is deeply troubling.
I strongly welcome the inquiry into FAIs and I am delighted that Lord Cullen will lead it. I will support Margaret Smith's amendment at decision time and I suspect that most members will do likewise.
Whether the current system meets the standard I have described is at best questionable. Michael McMahon gave us a good example of when families want an FAI and feel that they have been let down because no judicial inquiry has been undertaken. As several members have said, the Fatal Accidents and Sudden Deaths Inquiry (Scotland) Act was passed in 1976. Everybody agrees that, 30 years later, it looks old, tired and inefficient. I think that Michael Matheson made the good point that any future legislation should be flexible.
Angus Robertson MP perhaps summed up the situation best when, on the seventh of this month, he described the system as "beleaguered and backlogged". That statement formed part of his second claim of SNP action on the issue, further to his remarks of June last year, when he said that the new SNP Government had acted to ensure that the Scottish legal system played its part in investigating overseas military deaths.
I am pleased that Frank Mulholland has said that Lord Cullen's new review will report in a year and I agree entirely with Margaret Smith that the issue is extremely complex and that time needs to be taken to get it right, but will the cabinet secretary give us an idea of how soon after the inquiry concludes the Government will take action?
Several pertinent questions need to be asked before we move forward. For example, should the number of mandatory inquiries be greater? Could the system cope with more? Do we supply sufficient information to victims' families? Bill Aitken was right to say that families need more assistance with how to ask for an FAI—with what the system is, where to go and who to ask. Many families seem unaware that if they do not call for an FAI from the outset, they will not have a second chance to do so. For those reasons, I fully support the upcoming review.
I agree with the comments of Frank Mulholland, Margaret Smith and others about Lord Cullen. I am delighted that one of my constituents—a man who is well known in the legal profession, who has significant experience in public inquiries and who is a former Lord Justice General—has agreed to take on the review. I suggest that, for him, retirement has not lasted long. However, it is also important to examine what can be done now to speed up the process, particularly for inquiries into the deaths of service personnel.
Margaret Smith and others have comprehensively covered fatal accident inquiries in the military, so I will not go into the detail, but I offer my support to all those who spoke. Keith Brown made a telling speech that used his personal experience and he brought a personal perspective to the issue.
I regret to introduce slight discord into the debate, but I must ask whether the Scottish Labour Party supports the remarks of Des Browne, the UK Government's Secretary of State for Defence, who has called for strongly worded criticism of the Ministry of Defence to be outlawed from inquests into soldiers' deaths. Surely if an inquiry system is to function in any practical sense, it cannot be censored by any Government, any Government official or any Government minister. The fact that a senior UK Cabinet minister would suggest anything to the contrary is deeply troubling.
I strongly welcome the inquiry into FAIs and I am delighted that Lord Cullen will lead it. I will support Margaret Smith's amendment at decision time and I suspect that most members will do likewise.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Alex Fergusson):
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on S3M-1638, in the name of Frank Mulholland, on fatal accident inquiries. Members might wish to note that a revised se...
The Solicitor General for Scotland (Frank Mulholland):
I welcome the opportunity to open today's debate. On 7 March, the Cabinet Secretary for Justice announced that he and the Lord Advocate had agreed that there...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
The Solicitor General for Scotland is opening the debate on the Government's behalf, so will he answer my question on the Government's behalf? What is the Go...
The Solicitor General for Scotland:
I thank the member for his question, which raises an important point. The matter is reserved, because defence is reserved, so it needs to be considered and w...
Margaret Smith (Edinburgh West) (LD):
LD
I welcome the debate and Lord Cullen's forthcoming review, which will be the first proper review of the legislation on fatal accident inquiries in more than ...
Keith Brown (Ochil) (SNP):
SNP
I seek clarification. Margaret Smith has mentioned Scottish soldiers a couple of times, and her amendment mentions both"personnel, normally domiciled in Scot...
Margaret Smith:
LD
Yes. I included the phrase "normally domiciled in Scotland" to clarify that.Families who have lost loved ones through service for our country deserve our sup...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow Kelvin) (Lab):
Lab
I begin by welcoming the review of the legislation governing fatal accident inquiries in Scotland. I particularly welcome the choice of Lord Cullen of Whitek...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con):
Con
This is a useful debate. As members of the Justice Committee will be aware, I was minded to recommend that, as a result of a petition from Norman Dunning on ...
Keith Brown (Ochil) (SNP):
SNP
The motion welcomes an independent review by a figure of the highest reputation and legal standing to resolve a set of problems that I hope we all agree exis...
Michael McMahon (Hamilton North and Bellshill) (Lab):
Lab
When I had the privilege of being convener of the Public Petitions Committee, two of the most harrowing petitions that I encountered, from Enable and from th...
Christine Grahame (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I welcome this extremely interesting debate. The Solicitor General and the Cabinet Secretary for Justice are aware that, along with Margaret Smith and, as it...
Helen Eadie (Dunfermline East) (Lab):
Lab
Thank you for giving me the opportunity to contribute to this afternoon's debate. Like Pauline McNeill and Michael McMahon, I will support the amendment in t...
Michael Matheson (Falkirk West) (SNP):
SNP
I welcome the review and the fact that Lord Cullen has been appointed to undertake it. As many have said, he is an individual with great experience in this f...
Mike Pringle (Edinburgh South) (LD):
LD
Will Michael Matheson comment on whether we should consider adopting in legislation the system in America, where it is illegal to overtake a school bus at an...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan):
SNP
That is a bit far away from the subject of fatal accident inquires.
Michael Matheson:
SNP
It is, but it is an issue that a fatal accident inquiry could consider, and it may be one of its recommendations. That brings me neatly to the issue of an in...
Karen Gillon (Clydesdale) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to participate in the debate. It is an important one on an issue that affects families and communities the length and breadth of Sc...
Nigel Don (North East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I will address my remarks—as usual, very late in the debate—to one particular issue that is expected to be considered during the review: the status of recomm...
Mike Pringle (Edinburgh South) (LD):
LD
Scotland is widely perceived to be a reasonably safe place to live and it is relied on as such. Whatever activity someone takes part in, be it white-water ra...
John Lamont (Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con):
Con
The debate and the review of the law on fatal accident inquiries are welcome. As others have said, Lord Cullen's wealth of experience makes him ideally equip...
Christine Grahame:
SNP
Does the member share my concern about the deterioration of evidence when there are delays?
John Lamont:
Con
Indeed. If things are not dealt with in a timely manner, there is a danger that evidence becomes less good and less reliable. I agree with Christine Grahame'...
Paul Martin (Glasgow Springburn) (Lab):
Lab
Despite popular belief, we occasionally agree with the Cabinet Secretary for Justice, and the time is right for us to support him in his review of the legisl...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill):
SNP
I welcome the spirit in which the debate has taken place and the concordat that the parties reached beforehand on the amendment, which we are happy to suppor...
Pauline McNeill:
Lab
I know that we will have a debate on this matter, but will the cabinet secretary first of all accept and act on the words of the Secretary of State for Defen...
Kenny MacAskill:
SNP
The short answer is that we cannot act until we have the flexibility provided by changes to the Scotland Act 1998. We are a creature of that statute and are ...
Karen Gillon:
Lab
If the Parliament votes for the amendment in the name of Margaret Smith, which suggests that the holding of FAIs into the deaths of Scottish service personne...
Kenny MacAskill:
SNP
We have indicated our general support for the idea—that is why we support Margaret Smith's amendment. I would be delighted if we could deal with the issue ou...
Margaret Smith:
LD
Is it the cabinet secretary's understanding that the UK Government would be prepared to support the making of a section 30 order on the issue, given that bot...