Chamber
Plenary, 15 Mar 2007
15 Mar 2007 · S2 · Plenary
Item of business
Custodial Sentences and Weapons (Scotland) Bill: Stage 3
At what stage can proper rehabilitation services and support start? At stage 1 and stage 2, Colin Fox made good points about the time it would take the prison service and others to identify an offender's particular problems before signposting to other services. Such points have been acknowledged in the policy memorandum that accompanies the bill, and acknowledged by the minister time and time again, but Colin Fox's amendments would make some very short sentences even shorter. He talked about licence. I am not sure whether he was listening at committee meetings, but the Executive offered clarification of the conditions that could be applied with regard to licence. It is not just a bond of good behaviour; it can be more than that.
I disagree with Bill Aitken. When I visited Edinburgh prison, I spoke to a prison officer who had indeed heard of a prison sentence of fewer than 14 days. He told me that, for a prisoner who was sentenced on a Thursday to seven days, reception was on the Friday morning and release on the Friday afternoon, because of the automatic release after half the sentence, and because people are not released on weekends. Kenny MacAskill made a similar point. Mr Fox's amendments would return that absurd characteristic of the present system—which we want to move away from with the bill—into statute. That would be a retrograde step. Amendments 16 to 19 and 33 cannot be supported.
I disagree with Bill Aitken. When I visited Edinburgh prison, I spoke to a prison officer who had indeed heard of a prison sentence of fewer than 14 days. He told me that, for a prisoner who was sentenced on a Thursday to seven days, reception was on the Friday morning and release on the Friday afternoon, because of the automatic release after half the sentence, and because people are not released on weekends. Kenny MacAskill made a similar point. Mr Fox's amendments would return that absurd characteristic of the present system—which we want to move away from with the bill—into statute. That would be a retrograde step. Amendments 16 to 19 and 33 cannot be supported.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Mr George Reid):
NPA
The next item of business is stage 3 proceedings on the Custodial Sentences and Weapons (Scotland) Bill. Members should have with them copies of the bill as ...
Section 4—Basic definitions
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
Group 1 is minor and technical amendments. Amendment 1, in the name of the minister, is grouped with amendments 2, 3, 45, 4, 48, 54, 65, 68, 69, 71, 74, 6 to...
The Deputy Minister for Justice (Johann Lamont):
Lab
This large group of amendments deals with a number of technical and drafting issues that have resulted from a final proofreading of the bill's provisions. Th...
Amendment 1 agreed to.
Amendment 2 moved—Johann Lamont—and agreed to.
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
Group 2 is on the abolition of custody-only sentences. Amendment 16, in the name of Colin Fox, is grouped with amendments 17 to 19 and 33. Again, I draw memb...
Colin Fox (Lothians) (SSP):
SSP
The purpose of the amendments is to address what has been widely accepted as an anomaly in the bill—the fact that offenders who receive 14-day sentences serv...
Mr Kenny MacAskill (Lothians) (SNP):
SNP
On the face of it, Mr Fox's comments and the points that were made by Susan Matheson in Sacro's submission have some merit. However, we need to look at these...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con):
Con
Colin Fox is technically correct to say that the bill appears to contain an anomaly. However, in my experience, sentences of 14 days or fewer are unheard of....
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
At what stage can proper rehabilitation services and support start? At stage 1 and stage 2, Colin Fox made good points about the time it would take the priso...
Johann Lamont:
Lab
Amendments 16 to 19 and 33 seek to address Mr Fox's concern that custody-only prisoners could spend longer in prison than those custody and community sentenc...
Colin Fox:
SSP
Those members who argue that the current system is in disrepute are absolutely correct. That is what the bill seeks to address. However, the passage of the p...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
The question is, that amendment 16 be agreed to. Are we agreed?
Members:
No.
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
There will be a division. Since this is the first division in these proceedings, there will be a five-minute suspension.
Meeting suspended.
On resuming—
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
We will proceed with the division on amendment 16.
ForBaird, Shiona (North East Scotland) (Green) Ballance, Chris (South of Scotland) (Green) Fox, Colin (Lothians) (SSP) Harper, Robin (Lothians) (Green) Harvi...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
The result of the division is: For 6, Against 94, Abstentions 0.
Amendment 16 disagreed to.
Amendment 17 moved—Colin Fox.
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
The question is, that amendment 17 be agreed to. Are we agreed?
Members:
No.
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
There will be a division.
ForBaird, Shiona (North East Scotland) (Green) Ballance, Chris (South of Scotland) (Green) Fox, Colin (Lothians) (SSP) Harper, Robin (Lothians) (Green) Harvi...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
The result of the division is: For 6, Against 94, Abstentions 0.
Amendment 17 disagreed to.
Amendment 3 moved—Johann Lamont—and agreed to.