Chamber
Plenary, 15 Feb 2007
15 Feb 2007 · S2 · Plenary
Item of business
Crichton University Campus
I also thank Elaine Murray for securing today's debate on what is a very important subject to Dumfries and Galloway, as well as to the south of Scotland and Scotland more generally. If anyone is any doubt about the importance of this debate, they need only look at the public gallery and see the number of people who have travelled up here today. Members from the south of Scotland will have received a significant volume of e-mails and correspondence on the subject. It is very important that the Crichton flourishes, and we need to do everything that we can to ensure that that happens, rather than simply talk about it.
Many other members touched on the demographic trends in Dumfries and Galloway, which are truly frightening in some respects. The depopulation of young people from the area will have serious connotations if current trends are allowed to continue. Those trends are based on the continuation of the Crichton project rather than on its diminution. If we want to retain young people in, and attract them to, Dumfries and Galloway, surely a project such as the Crichton is one of the key ways of achieving that.
The project will be successful only if it is a broad one. Members spoke about the interaction of other institutions. Alasdair Morgan mentioned the importance of offering general as well as vocational education at the Crichton, and he is absolutely right. We have to value education in itself. Many people who undertake a general education will subsequently be of great importance to the economy and the future of Dumfries and Galloway. A broad range of institutions and subjects on the campus is crucial to making the Crichton as much and as attractive as it can be.
Other members touched on one of the thorniest issues—equity with the Highlands and Islands. We should be clear that none of us seeks to take anything away from the Highlands and Islands; none of us decries the concept of the UHI Millennium Institute or anything else. We simply want fairness and equal treatment because some of the challenges that the south-west and south of Scotland face are similar to those in the Highlands and Islands. There is no reason why we in the south should be treated less favourably than people in the Highlands and Islands. There is a serious case for the Government to look closely at how the Highlands and Islands is treated and how the south is treated and to implement measures to ensure that they are treated equitably.
I saw the minister raise an eyebrow when Fiona Hyslop spoke about not intervening directly in decisions by universities. I understand the controversial nature of telling a university what to do, but taxpayers' money funds such places, and taxes are paid in Dumfries and Galloway as they are everywhere else. If we cannot tell the University of Glasgow where to put its student places, surely we could ring fence finance for the Crichton more effectively to ensure that it is sustained.
There is a way forward that we can look at on a cross-party basis—it is not all doom and gloom. There is an opportunity for us to make this work and it is important that the minister takes that away from this evening's debate. I would like him to comment on the powers that he has to give more direction to ensure that the Crichton money is rooted at the Crichton and is protected.
Alex Fergusson quoted some constituents and I will end with another important quote:
"the truth is that we need more, better-educated young people with higher-level skills if our economy is to meet the global challenge from fast-growing economies such as India and China, which are already investing substantially in higher education."
Those are the words of the Prime Minister, writing in today's edition of The Daily Telegraph. What he says is as true of Dumfries and Galloway as it is of the rest of the country. I hope that the Executive will acknowledge that by showing some support for the Crichton.
Many other members touched on the demographic trends in Dumfries and Galloway, which are truly frightening in some respects. The depopulation of young people from the area will have serious connotations if current trends are allowed to continue. Those trends are based on the continuation of the Crichton project rather than on its diminution. If we want to retain young people in, and attract them to, Dumfries and Galloway, surely a project such as the Crichton is one of the key ways of achieving that.
The project will be successful only if it is a broad one. Members spoke about the interaction of other institutions. Alasdair Morgan mentioned the importance of offering general as well as vocational education at the Crichton, and he is absolutely right. We have to value education in itself. Many people who undertake a general education will subsequently be of great importance to the economy and the future of Dumfries and Galloway. A broad range of institutions and subjects on the campus is crucial to making the Crichton as much and as attractive as it can be.
Other members touched on one of the thorniest issues—equity with the Highlands and Islands. We should be clear that none of us seeks to take anything away from the Highlands and Islands; none of us decries the concept of the UHI Millennium Institute or anything else. We simply want fairness and equal treatment because some of the challenges that the south-west and south of Scotland face are similar to those in the Highlands and Islands. There is no reason why we in the south should be treated less favourably than people in the Highlands and Islands. There is a serious case for the Government to look closely at how the Highlands and Islands is treated and how the south is treated and to implement measures to ensure that they are treated equitably.
I saw the minister raise an eyebrow when Fiona Hyslop spoke about not intervening directly in decisions by universities. I understand the controversial nature of telling a university what to do, but taxpayers' money funds such places, and taxes are paid in Dumfries and Galloway as they are everywhere else. If we cannot tell the University of Glasgow where to put its student places, surely we could ring fence finance for the Crichton more effectively to ensure that it is sustained.
There is a way forward that we can look at on a cross-party basis—it is not all doom and gloom. There is an opportunity for us to make this work and it is important that the minister takes that away from this evening's debate. I would like him to comment on the powers that he has to give more direction to ensure that the Crichton money is rooted at the Crichton and is protected.
Alex Fergusson quoted some constituents and I will end with another important quote:
"the truth is that we need more, better-educated young people with higher-level skills if our economy is to meet the global challenge from fast-growing economies such as India and China, which are already investing substantially in higher education."
Those are the words of the Prime Minister, writing in today's edition of The Daily Telegraph. What he says is as true of Dumfries and Galloway as it is of the rest of the country. I hope that the Executive will acknowledge that by showing some support for the Crichton.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Trish Godman):
Lab
The final item of business today is a members' business debate on motion S2M-5444, in the name of Elaine Murray, on the threat to the Crichton campus in Dumf...
Motion debated,
That the Parliament recognises and applauds the success of the Crichton university campus in Dumfries over the past seven years and the contribution made by ...
Dr Elaine Murray (Dumfries) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the group of stakeholders who are in the public gallery. They comprise students, staff, the chief executive of Dumfries and Galloway Council, and p...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
Before we move to the open debate, I remind those in the public gallery that it is not appropriate for them to applaud.
Alasdair Morgan (South of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I am glad that Elaine Murray has secured a debate on a topic that is of such vital importance to the future of the south-west of Scotland. As time is very br...
Alex Fergusson (Galloway and Upper Nithsdale) (Con):
Con
I congratulate Elaine Murray on lodging the motion and I echo her warm welcome to those who have made the journey up from the south-west for the debate.Let u...
Chris Ballance (South of Scotland) (Green):
Green
I congratulate Elaine Murray on securing this important debate. Indeed, the debate on the threat to the Crichton campus is currently the most important debat...
Ms Rosemary Byrne (South of Scotland) (Sol):
Sol
I thank Elaine Murray for securing the debate. I also acknowledge and thank the number of people who have come along today. I think that we would all agree t...
Fiona Hyslop (Lothians) (SNP):
SNP
I thank Elaine Murray for bringing this important subject to the chamber. As the first non-South of Scotland MSP to speak in the debate, I will discuss the n...
Derek Brownlee (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
I also thank Elaine Murray for securing today's debate on what is a very important subject to Dumfries and Galloway, as well as to the south of Scotland and ...
Robin Harper (Lothians) (Green):
Green
Early in the Parliament's first session, I had the honour and great pleasure to take part in an environmental symposium at Crichton College. I kept up that r...
The Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Allan Wilson):
Lab
I thank Elaine Murray for providing us with the opportunity to debate a subject that is of great importance to our policy position, and for her speech, which...
Alasdair Morgan:
SNP
The minister should just cut to the chase: does he or the Executive have a view on whether they would prefer the University of Glasgow to stay at Crichton ca...
Allan Wilson:
Lab
I advise the member to be patient in that regard.On student numbers, I believe that the overall level of provision at the Crichton campus should, at the very...
Chris Ballance:
Green
The minister's allotted time is running out, and we would very much like him to address the question that Alasdair Morgan asked: does he support the range of...
Allan Wilson:
Lab
I thought that I had just explained to Chris Ballance and other members that ministers are denied by law from doing what he suggests. Interruption. Chris Bal...
Alasdair Morgan:
SNP
Will the minister give way?
Alex Fergusson:
Con
Will the minister give way?
Allan Wilson:
Lab
Let me make progress.The funding council allocates a block teaching grant to institutions. It is up to each university, as an autonomous body, to decide how ...
Alasdair Morgan:
SNP
Will the minister give way?
Allan Wilson:
Lab
I will continue my point.Comparisons have been made with the level of provision and investment in the Highlands and Islands—Alasdair Morgan made such compari...
Chris Ballance:
Green
Will the minister meet the funding council to discuss the issue?
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Lab
Do not intervene from a sedentary position, Mr Ballance.
Allan Wilson:
Lab
I ask Chris Ballance to be patient, as I will come to that point.I pay tribute to Glasgow University for its support of Crichton campus and I hope that it wi...
Meeting closed at 17:53.