Chamber
Plenary, 07 Feb 2007
07 Feb 2007 · S2 · Plenary
Item of business
Tartan
The Scottish Register of Tartans Bill came before the Enterprise and Culture Committee, and I rise as a member of that committee to discuss how we reacted to it and how our thinking evolved.
Like many other members, I started by thinking that tartan is a recent addition that grew with the Victorians and which has nothing to do with history. The bill is being promoted by a Tory. He proposes that we have a separate register and keeper, yet I thought that the Tories were all about reducing bureaucracy. I argued that the bill was not necessary, because it should be possible to get agreement among the existing privately-owned registers.
I then thought about the history of tartan. There is an argument that poor people rarely had access to dyes or fancy patterns, that tartan was used mainly to signify rank and wealth and that only the rich could afford the patterns and coloured cloths. I wonder about that when I think about the pink lining in Jamie Stone's jacket—it is a pity that he is not here to show us it.
As incomes rose among the Victorian business classes on the back of commercial activities, which we heard the moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland describe earlier, people started to become interested in all things supposedly Scottish and the tartan market boomed. Tartan has become a symbol and an emblem of Scottish culture and, yes, there is evidence that it has been used for hundreds of years.
Jim Mather talked about having new and interesting things. Tartans have been created for the G8, the Highland year of culture, Scottish Power and other big organisations and the Commonwealth games. As I looked into the matter, having spoken to the Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning, the Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport and Jamie McGrigor, I thought that there was a good argument for doing something—I am thinking of genealogy, tourism and commercial activities—to take advantage of something that is uniquely Scottish, whether or not it is recognised as widely as it might be.
I welcome the minister's promise to commission work with the textiles group and hope that that work produces something.
I turn to the issue of a publicly owned and publicly managed register. We have many official registers in this country. I remind everybody of my registered interest as chair of the Scottish Library and Information Council. Many museums, galleries and other registers, including the National Library of Scotland and the National Museums of Scotland, are members of that group.
The Enterprise and Culture Committee was persuaded of the strength of Jamie McGrigor's argument, but we remained unconvinced of the need for legislation and for a separate keeper to be funded. I am glad that the Executive has picked that up and I hope that the Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport will be involved in the discussions, given that she has responsibility for the Registers of Scotland and museums.
I would like to hear in the minister's closing remarks a little more about his commitment to the register and how he hopes that it will be developed. I hope that Jamie McGrigor will be reassured, both by what he has heard and by the evident cross-party support, that there is a commitment to take forward the register, not just in the rest of this session but after the election. I hope that he is reassured sufficiently to withdraw his bill. I look forward to continuing to work with him and with the ministerial team, and I will help in any way that I can, through the Enterprise and Culture Committee.
Like many other members, I started by thinking that tartan is a recent addition that grew with the Victorians and which has nothing to do with history. The bill is being promoted by a Tory. He proposes that we have a separate register and keeper, yet I thought that the Tories were all about reducing bureaucracy. I argued that the bill was not necessary, because it should be possible to get agreement among the existing privately-owned registers.
I then thought about the history of tartan. There is an argument that poor people rarely had access to dyes or fancy patterns, that tartan was used mainly to signify rank and wealth and that only the rich could afford the patterns and coloured cloths. I wonder about that when I think about the pink lining in Jamie Stone's jacket—it is a pity that he is not here to show us it.
As incomes rose among the Victorian business classes on the back of commercial activities, which we heard the moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland describe earlier, people started to become interested in all things supposedly Scottish and the tartan market boomed. Tartan has become a symbol and an emblem of Scottish culture and, yes, there is evidence that it has been used for hundreds of years.
Jim Mather talked about having new and interesting things. Tartans have been created for the G8, the Highland year of culture, Scottish Power and other big organisations and the Commonwealth games. As I looked into the matter, having spoken to the Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning, the Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport and Jamie McGrigor, I thought that there was a good argument for doing something—I am thinking of genealogy, tourism and commercial activities—to take advantage of something that is uniquely Scottish, whether or not it is recognised as widely as it might be.
I welcome the minister's promise to commission work with the textiles group and hope that that work produces something.
I turn to the issue of a publicly owned and publicly managed register. We have many official registers in this country. I remind everybody of my registered interest as chair of the Scottish Library and Information Council. Many museums, galleries and other registers, including the National Library of Scotland and the National Museums of Scotland, are members of that group.
The Enterprise and Culture Committee was persuaded of the strength of Jamie McGrigor's argument, but we remained unconvinced of the need for legislation and for a separate keeper to be funded. I am glad that the Executive has picked that up and I hope that the Minister for Tourism, Culture and Sport will be involved in the discussions, given that she has responsibility for the Registers of Scotland and museums.
I would like to hear in the minister's closing remarks a little more about his commitment to the register and how he hopes that it will be developed. I hope that Jamie McGrigor will be reassured, both by what he has heard and by the evident cross-party support, that there is a commitment to take forward the register, not just in the rest of this session but after the election. I hope that he is reassured sufficiently to withdraw his bill. I look forward to continuing to work with him and with the ministerial team, and I will help in any way that I can, through the Enterprise and Culture Committee.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Mr George Reid):
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on the promotion of tartan and Scotland's tartan industry.
The Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning (Allan Wilson):
Lab
I welcome the opportunity that today's debate gives us to look at one of Scotland's most iconic and readily recognisable images—tartan. The subject evokes a ...
Mr John Swinney (North Tayside) (SNP):
SNP
How does the minister intend to build consensus around the objective that he just outlined—which I support fully—to ensure that some practical action comes o...
Allan Wilson:
Lab
I will explain the initial steps by which we will seek to secure the consensus that John Swinney and I, and probably the whole chamber, wish to see. I tend t...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
I might have misheard the minister, but I believe that he said that the situation with tartan is wholly unregulated. However, the Scottish Tartans Authority ...
Allan Wilson:
Lab
The member is correct. It has been suggested that there is little time for this debate, but it seems to have stimulated the kind of discussion that I hoped i...
Jim Mather (Highlands and Islands) (SNP):
SNP
I give the warmest possible welcome to the minister's words and, indeed, welcome this opportunity to reinforce tartan's iconic importance.Scotland, of course...
Margo MacDonald (Lothians) (Ind):
Ind
With reference to the learned professor's claim that 98 per cent of the world's population has some idea of what Scotland means, do we have any notion of how...
Jim Mather:
SNP
Professor Michael Porter's reputation suggests that a somewhat more systematic approach would have been taken. Certainly, his work has passed muster—I believ...
Mr Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD):
LD
Alex Salmond. Laughter.
Jim Mather:
SNP
If we are going to talk about the living dead, it might be Prime Minister's question time that features, Mr Stone. The book is all about the efficacy of trib...
Mr Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con):
Con
I congratulate Allan Wilson, the Deputy Minister for Enterprise and Lifelong Learning, on securing the debate.I listened carefully to what the minister said....
Mr Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD):
LD
I congratulate Jamie McGrigor on introducing the Scottish Register of Tartans Bill. I also congratulate members on their speeches, including Jim Mather. I ag...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con):
Con
I wonder whether the member would like to take this opportunity to apologise on behalf of the Whig Government of the time for the act of proscription 1747.
Mr Stone:
LD
That is tempting.Tartan was proscribed north of the Highland line. If a person wore a greatcoat or jacket of tartan, they were subject either to six months' ...
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
It was George IV.
Mr Stone:
LD
That is absolutely correct. I stand corrected—I meant George IV.Sir Walter Scott persuaded George IV to come north to Edinburgh in 1822. It is well known tha...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
We come to the open debate. If we do not have too many digressions, every member who wants to speak will be able to do so.
Mr Kenneth Macintosh (Eastwood) (Lab):
Lab
I am pleased to speak in the debate. I inform members of my interest in Scotland's tartan industry: my wife's family has been involved in kilt making for six...
John Swinburne (Central Scotland) (SSCUP):
SSCUP
Does the member agree that, unless protection is built into the Scottish Register of Tartans Bill such that the only tartan that matters is that produced in ...
Mr Macintosh:
Lab
I admire John Swinburne's hopes, but unfortunately I do not think that what he suggests will be possible. We have to take an inclusive approach to tartan. I ...
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
I appreciate the member's arguments, but can he appreciate that part of the success of the modern tartan industry has been the lack of bureaucracy? We have a...
Mr Macintosh:
Lab
I appreciate Mr Purvis's concerns, just as I appreciated Mr Swinburne's concerns. However, I do not think that the register will take a judgmental approach a...
Mr Kenny MacAskill (Lothians) (SNP):
SNP
As my colleague Jim Mather has stated, the Scottish National Party welcomes the Executive's proposals. We look forward to seeing what the Executive will outl...
Margo MacDonald (Lothians) (Ind):
Ind
I congratulate the minister on changing his mind. I certainly remember the time when he and people of his age group denigrated tartan—I will come back to tha...
Christine May (Central Fife) (Lab):
Lab
The Scottish Register of Tartans Bill came before the Enterprise and Culture Committee, and I rise as a member of that committee to discuss how we reacted to...
Jeremy Purvis (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
With Lochcarron of Scotland, Andrew Elliot Ltd and Robert Noble in my constituency, I am extremely lucky to be the constituency representative of the finest ...
Margo MacDonald:
Ind
Will the member give way?
Jeremy Purvis:
LD
If I have time later on, I will give way.
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Murray Tosh):
Con
You will not have time; you have one minute left.