Chamber
Plenary, 20 Feb 2003
20 Feb 2003 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Criminal Justice (Scotland) Bill
At stage 1, I expressed my concern that the bill represented a return to the bad old days of the law reform (miscellaneous provisions) (Scotland) bills. The past two days have proved my point. As we have worked through the amendments, we have jumped between sections that do not seem to relate to one other. The members of the Justice 2 Committee deserve praise for their hard work in following those many jumps in committee.
I am pleased that the passing of the bill will mean the introduction of lifetime supervision of sex offenders, which was a key recommendation of the MacLean report and has been SNP policy since long before that report. George Foulkes might have felt that the MacLean report's recommendations were "uncosted nonsense", but I am pleased that Labour members of the Scottish Parliament seem to disagree with the ex-minister.
Drugs courts are another SNP policy that was at first derided, and then adopted, by the Executive parties. The bill acknowledges the success of the operation of the pilot courts, the first of which opened in Glasgow in November 2001. That was an important step.
The introduction of victim statements to our judicial process means that the court will hear of the impact that a crime has had on the victim. Issues remain to be addressed. I hope that the pilot project will be evaluated and that, if it is not successful, the idea will be dropped or seriously amended.
The most contentious part of the bill was undoubtedly section 43, which deals with the physical chastisement of children. There has been considerable change on that since the bill was introduced. There are still problems to do with the practicality of the provisions, rather than the message that they send. Everyone concentrated on the message, but the practicalities are equally important. Only time will tell who was right.
As I indicated earlier, I continue to have concerns about police custody and security officers.
One of the consequences of such a wide-ranging bill is that it leaves the door wide open to an even more wide-ranging set of amendments. The amendment that Donald Gorrie lodged to introduce the concept of offences aggravated by religious prejudice was a prime example. Although I do not believe that the bill's provisions on that will achieve what the minister, the Executive or Mr Gorrie wants them to achieve, I do not doubt their sincerity, nor do I oppose their worthy intentions.
In conclusion, the bill contains many changes for which my party and I have been pushing for some time—in some cases, since long before members of the Executive parties had been won over. In spite of the fact that the bill has some failings, it has the support of the SNP.
I am pleased that the passing of the bill will mean the introduction of lifetime supervision of sex offenders, which was a key recommendation of the MacLean report and has been SNP policy since long before that report. George Foulkes might have felt that the MacLean report's recommendations were "uncosted nonsense", but I am pleased that Labour members of the Scottish Parliament seem to disagree with the ex-minister.
Drugs courts are another SNP policy that was at first derided, and then adopted, by the Executive parties. The bill acknowledges the success of the operation of the pilot courts, the first of which opened in Glasgow in November 2001. That was an important step.
The introduction of victim statements to our judicial process means that the court will hear of the impact that a crime has had on the victim. Issues remain to be addressed. I hope that the pilot project will be evaluated and that, if it is not successful, the idea will be dropped or seriously amended.
The most contentious part of the bill was undoubtedly section 43, which deals with the physical chastisement of children. There has been considerable change on that since the bill was introduced. There are still problems to do with the practicality of the provisions, rather than the message that they send. Everyone concentrated on the message, but the practicalities are equally important. Only time will tell who was right.
As I indicated earlier, I continue to have concerns about police custody and security officers.
One of the consequences of such a wide-ranging bill is that it leaves the door wide open to an even more wide-ranging set of amendments. The amendment that Donald Gorrie lodged to introduce the concept of offences aggravated by religious prejudice was a prime example. Although I do not believe that the bill's provisions on that will achieve what the minister, the Executive or Mr Gorrie wants them to achieve, I do not doubt their sincerity, nor do I oppose their worthy intentions.
In conclusion, the bill contains many changes for which my party and I have been pushing for some time—in some cases, since long before members of the Executive parties had been won over. In spite of the fact that the bill has some failings, it has the support of the SNP.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Mr Murray Tosh):
Con
The next item of business is a debate on motion S1M-3730, in the name of Mr Jim Wallace, that the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Bill be passed.
The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Justice (Mr Jim Wallace):
LD
The Criminal Justice (Scotland) Bill is a substantial and significant piece of legislation. It is only right that it should have been subject to rigorous and...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Con
A long list of members wish to take part in the debate, so I ask everyone to keep tightly to the three-minute time allocation.
Roseanna Cunningham (Perth) (SNP):
SNP
At stage 1, I expressed my concern that the bill represented a return to the bad old days of the law reform (miscellaneous provisions) (Scotland) bills. The ...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con):
Con
The minister mentioned some aspects of the bill that are highly satisfactory and for which we commend the Executive. Other aspects, such as civilianisation a...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow Kelvin) (Lab):
Lab
I begin by thanking the Justice 2 Committee very much for its hard work. There was not a single issue that the Parliament was concerned about that the commit...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Con
I will call as many members as I can.
Mr Duncan Hamilton (Highlands and Islands) (SNP):
SNP
I, too, support the bill, although I do not do so unreservedly. I thank my colleagues on the Justice 2 Committee. As I come to the end of my time in the Parl...
Johann Lamont (Glasgow Pollok) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to welcome the passing of this important bill. I, too, congratulate the Justice 2 Committee—in particular the convener—on its hard ...
Lord James Douglas-Hamilton (Lothians) (Con):
Con
It is regrettable that there has been insufficient time to give full attention to many of the issues that were before the committee. To give just one example...
George Lyon (Argyll and Bute) (LD):
LD
As the Deputy First Minister said, the bill is a substantial piece of legislation, which will have a major impact in improving Scotland's criminal justice sy...
Dr Richard Simpson (Ochil) (Lab):
Lab
I join others in congratulating the minister and the committee on the way in which they have tackled the issues in the bill.The Justice 2 Committee's scrutin...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Con
If Irene McGugan will restrict herself to two minutes, I will be able to give two minutes to Brian Fitzpatrick, who will be the last member to speak.
Irene McGugan (North-East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I will confine my remarks to the physical punishment of children. The bill is a step in the right direction, but it is a small step. As Richard Simpson sugge...
Brian Fitzpatrick (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (Lab):
Lab
As Johann Lamont mentioned, the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Bill represents the culmination of a lot of hard work by the subject committee and occasional vis...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Con
My regrets to the four members whose names remain on my screen, but the clock has beaten us. I call Hugh Henry to wind up the debate.
The Deputy Minister for Justice (Hugh Henry):
Lab
Like the minister, I thank all those who worked so hard on the bill and the organisations and individuals who provided written submissions and gave oral evid...