Chamber
Plenary, 15 Jan 2003
15 Jan 2003 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Commissioner for Children and Young People (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
As they said in "Beyond the Fringe", Esau was a hairy man, but I am a smooth man.
Sorry, Ian Jenkins has thrown me, completely and utterly.
Like all the other members who have spoken, whom I congratulate on their speeches, I support the bill. I want to make two important points that follow on from what Jackie Baillie and Donald Gorrie said.
Reference has been made to the Scottish youth parliament, which is a splendid initiative by the Executive. I hope that the youth parliament will be rolled out to Scotland's more rural local authorities.
As Donald Gorrie rightly said, it is often the case that wrinklies parachute in their policies. I do not think that the commissioner will do that, but if he or she takes the route of telling children what subjects he or she wants to hear their views on, that would be wrong. I hope that in every classroom and scout hall, and wherever there are children, there will be a notice that tells children that if they want to make their views known to the commissioner, they should call this number or write to that address.
Jackie Baillie said that the commissioner will reflect the children's views back to us rather than reflecting our views to the children, and that is the right way to go about it. We must be careful not to fall into the trap of just telling children our views. I am sure that that is a danger. The children of Scotland must feel that they own their commissioner. If that is not the case, he or she will just be yet another old wrinkly who is on the establishment's side.
How often do we MSPs go to community councils and local authorities and hear them blaming the children and asking what should be done about the mess on the streets? They decide to write to the rector of the school and make the usual fuss. That is not what the children's commissioner will be about, and I believe that the minister recognises that.
I underline my earlier point: I hope that the commissioner will take the example of the Scottish youth parliament and ask each of the 32 local authorities what it is doing about including children and young people in their decision-making processes. They should not just have the occasional chat in a modern studies class; they should convene, for example, a Highland youth parliament or an Ayrshire youth parliament. Let us roll out the idea.
The bill presents a terrific opportunity and I say to the committee, "Well done." Sir David, a committee bill such as this is an example of where you and the others on the Scottish Constitutional Convention designed a powerful tool for the Parliament, and it is nice to see that tool being deployed as effectively as it is being deployed today.
I congratulate my erstwhile colleagues on the Education, Culture and Sport Committee and I look forward to seeing the bill progress through the Parliament.
Sorry, Ian Jenkins has thrown me, completely and utterly.
Like all the other members who have spoken, whom I congratulate on their speeches, I support the bill. I want to make two important points that follow on from what Jackie Baillie and Donald Gorrie said.
Reference has been made to the Scottish youth parliament, which is a splendid initiative by the Executive. I hope that the youth parliament will be rolled out to Scotland's more rural local authorities.
As Donald Gorrie rightly said, it is often the case that wrinklies parachute in their policies. I do not think that the commissioner will do that, but if he or she takes the route of telling children what subjects he or she wants to hear their views on, that would be wrong. I hope that in every classroom and scout hall, and wherever there are children, there will be a notice that tells children that if they want to make their views known to the commissioner, they should call this number or write to that address.
Jackie Baillie said that the commissioner will reflect the children's views back to us rather than reflecting our views to the children, and that is the right way to go about it. We must be careful not to fall into the trap of just telling children our views. I am sure that that is a danger. The children of Scotland must feel that they own their commissioner. If that is not the case, he or she will just be yet another old wrinkly who is on the establishment's side.
How often do we MSPs go to community councils and local authorities and hear them blaming the children and asking what should be done about the mess on the streets? They decide to write to the rector of the school and make the usual fuss. That is not what the children's commissioner will be about, and I believe that the minister recognises that.
I underline my earlier point: I hope that the commissioner will take the example of the Scottish youth parliament and ask each of the 32 local authorities what it is doing about including children and young people in their decision-making processes. They should not just have the occasional chat in a modern studies class; they should convene, for example, a Highland youth parliament or an Ayrshire youth parliament. Let us roll out the idea.
The bill presents a terrific opportunity and I say to the committee, "Well done." Sir David, a committee bill such as this is an example of where you and the others on the Scottish Constitutional Convention designed a powerful tool for the Parliament, and it is nice to see that tool being deployed as effectively as it is being deployed today.
I congratulate my erstwhile colleagues on the Education, Culture and Sport Committee and I look forward to seeing the bill progress through the Parliament.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Sir David Steel):
NPA
The first of our debates today is a debate on motion S1M-3689, in the name of Karen Gillon, on stage 1 of the Commissioner for Children and Young People (Sco...
Karen Gillon (Clydesdale) (Lab):
Lab
Members are sometimes surprised by how relevant the topic at time for reflection is to the debate that follows. Today's time for reflection was certainly rel...
The Minister for Education and Young People (Cathy Jamieson):
Lab
Like Karen Gillon, I welcome in particular the young people who have come to the public gallery to listen to the debate. The debate centres around the best i...
Irene McGugan (North-East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I begin by conveying apologies from Michael Russell, who is, unfortunately, unwell this afternoon. On a happier note, I congratulate Karen Gillon on her comp...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con):
Con
I offer the apologies of my colleague Brian Monteith, who is not able to be with us for the whole of this afternoon's debate. Unfortunately he is attending a...
Ian Jenkins (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
There is a sense of déjà vu about this debate, because it is not long since committee members talked about the report that established the case for the appoi...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
In the open debate, we have time for two short speeches of three minutes each.
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab):
Lab
I add my thanks to the clerks, to NEBU, to my parliamentary colleagues on the Education, Culture and Sport Committee and, in particular, to Irene McGugan. Su...
Donald Gorrie (Central Scotland) (LD):
LD
Speaking as a genuine wrinkly—unlike the young ladies on the Labour benches—I have been actively involved in discussing and promoting this subject over the p...
The Presiding Officer:
NPA
We now move to closing speeches, which should be of three minutes.
Mr Jamie Stone (Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross) (LD):
LD
I congratulate Karen Gillon and the Education, Culture and Sport Committee on introducing the bill. In years gone by, I was a member of the committee, but I ...
Ian Jenkins:
LD
I take it that Mr Stone is speaking as a smoothie, rather than as a wrinkly.
Mr Stone:
LD
As they said in "Beyond the Fringe", Esau was a hairy man, but I am a smooth man.Sorry, Ian Jenkins has thrown me, completely and utterly.Like all the other ...
Mr Brian Monteith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con):
Con
I thank the Presiding Officer for allowing me to arrive late for the debate following my attendance at a family funeral. I am pleased to be able to make a co...
Fiona McLeod (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
I begin by congratulating the committee on the work that it has done. The Parliament should also thank the committee for the work that it has done on the bil...
Karen Gillon:
Lab
Does Fiona McLeod accept that we have created a new public services ombudsman and that the Parliament should say to the ombudsman from the outset that they m...
Fiona McLeod:
SNP
I am not looking for the commissioner to be the last court of appeal, but having talked about exhausting the process, I hope that there will always be someon...
Cathy Jamieson:
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to say a few words in closing for the Executive. The debate has been short but useful. All members have given a clear commitment to...
Cathy Peattie (Falkirk East) (Lab):
Lab
I thank all the members who participated in the debate. The response has been positive, even from the wrinklies and the smoothie—wherever he is.The bill prov...