Chamber
Plenary, 09 Jan 2003
09 Jan 2003 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Child Protection Review
It is now almost six years since the Children (Scotland) Act 1995 came into force, which totally updated our child protection system from the one laid out in the Social Work (Scotland) Act 1968. A number of members who practised social work at that time felt confident and optimistic that the Children (Scotland) Act 1995 would provide a better framework for child protection than the one we had. However, in the light of experience in the past six years, it is disappointing to see the bureaucracy that has resulted from the 1995 act with regard to seeking child protection orders, child assessment orders and exclusion orders. The act has not lived up to our optimism.
It was clear that we had to update the old place of safety method, whereby a simple signature from a justice of the peace could result in someone entering the system quickly, but we replaced it with a system that is perhaps too complex and too difficult.
The review states:
"Emergency protection measures were used only rarely in the sample of cases which were looked at. Social workers were reluctant to apply for Child Protection Orders unless they could demonstrate immediate risk to a child and in some cases they were concerned about appearing in court and being cross examined about their work."
If that is the framework that is the bulwark of child protection, perhaps we should seriously examine it.
I welcome what the minister said in her speech about placing child protection committees on a more statutory footing. That is long overdue and will result in better practice throughout Scotland. I was a member of Fife's child protection committee and for about seven years chaired a local child protection group that was established throughout Fife. Local child protection groups that bring together voluntary and statutory sector workers from one geographical area to meet semi-regularly to discuss general issues—but not necessarily specific cases—are a good way to aid interagency co-operation and understanding. If we are to develop seriously the idea that child protection is not only a function of social workers, health visitors or paediatricians, but a function and an interest for us all, we must engender that in our local communities through bodies such as local child protection groups.
Ian Jenkins and Irene McGugan highlighted the report's reference to the pivotal role of social work. When social work works well, outcomes are good, but it is sad that, despite the interagency approach that we keep talking about, when social work does not perform well, the outcomes are poor. We must ensure that everyone progresses the child protection message.
When we discussed children's services last month, I observed that the varying attendance at child protection case conferences is disappointing. The only agency that is always represented at a case conference is social work. Often, health visitors are present and sometimes schools are represented, but it is rare that the medical profession is present. If we are to have a proper and cohesive child protection system, we must all ensure that people take it seriously.
Will the minister consider issuing further guidance to our local authorities on the use of section 38 of the Children (Scotland) Act 1995, which deals with refuges, so that people do not have to enter the system through formal child protection procedures? That would allow us to use that section for youngsters who are very troubled and need a bit of space. The section was another departure from the statutory intervention that we had to make in the past, but its use has been patchy throughout Scotland. We need to examine that seriously.
It was clear that we had to update the old place of safety method, whereby a simple signature from a justice of the peace could result in someone entering the system quickly, but we replaced it with a system that is perhaps too complex and too difficult.
The review states:
"Emergency protection measures were used only rarely in the sample of cases which were looked at. Social workers were reluctant to apply for Child Protection Orders unless they could demonstrate immediate risk to a child and in some cases they were concerned about appearing in court and being cross examined about their work."
If that is the framework that is the bulwark of child protection, perhaps we should seriously examine it.
I welcome what the minister said in her speech about placing child protection committees on a more statutory footing. That is long overdue and will result in better practice throughout Scotland. I was a member of Fife's child protection committee and for about seven years chaired a local child protection group that was established throughout Fife. Local child protection groups that bring together voluntary and statutory sector workers from one geographical area to meet semi-regularly to discuss general issues—but not necessarily specific cases—are a good way to aid interagency co-operation and understanding. If we are to develop seriously the idea that child protection is not only a function of social workers, health visitors or paediatricians, but a function and an interest for us all, we must engender that in our local communities through bodies such as local child protection groups.
Ian Jenkins and Irene McGugan highlighted the report's reference to the pivotal role of social work. When social work works well, outcomes are good, but it is sad that, despite the interagency approach that we keep talking about, when social work does not perform well, the outcomes are poor. We must ensure that everyone progresses the child protection message.
When we discussed children's services last month, I observed that the varying attendance at child protection case conferences is disappointing. The only agency that is always represented at a case conference is social work. Often, health visitors are present and sometimes schools are represented, but it is rare that the medical profession is present. If we are to have a proper and cohesive child protection system, we must all ensure that people take it seriously.
Will the minister consider issuing further guidance to our local authorities on the use of section 38 of the Children (Scotland) Act 1995, which deals with refuges, so that people do not have to enter the system through formal child protection procedures? That would allow us to use that section for youngsters who are very troubled and need a bit of space. The section was another departure from the statutory intervention that we had to make in the past, but its use has been patchy throughout Scotland. We need to examine that seriously.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Mr George Reid):
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S1M-3748, in the name of Cathy Jamieson, on the review of child protection, and two amendments to that motion.
The Minister for Education and Young People (Cathy Jamieson):
Lab
The new year is traditionally a time to look back and reflect, but also a time when we make our resolutions for the future and signal the changes that we wan...
Phil Gallie (South of Scotland) (Con):
Con
Will the minister give way?
Cathy Jamieson:
Lab
I am almost finished.We are not just listening to young people, but hearing them loud and clear and acting on their concerns.Presiding Officer, I am disappoi...
Irene McGugan (North-East Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
From the outset, I say that we welcome the review and its recommendations. It can only be good that the issue is being debated and addressed at a national le...
Bill Aitken (Glasgow) (Con):
Con
I apologise to the minister and to Irene McGugan for missing part of their speeches, although I explained my absence to them beforehand.The report of the chi...
Cathy Jamieson:
Lab
Does the member care to explain the comments that were attributed to Tory spokespersons yesterday? They did not welcome the funding that was announced to sup...
Bill Aitken:
Con
I personally did not issue that release. In any event, the obvious sense of that is that resources are finite, so such resources as are made available must h...
Scott Barrie (Dunfermline West) (Lab):
Lab
Does Mr Aitken agree that cases involving older young people who are in their teenage years can be quite complex, in that the grounds for referral will often...
Bill Aitken:
Con
I disagree in part with Mr Barrie's original premise. I agree that it quite frequently happens that younger offenders can offend because they have been offen...
Ian Jenkins (Tweeddale, Ettrick and Lauderdale) (LD):
LD
I start by welcoming the various and wide-ranging announcements that the minister has made today. Child protection issues almost always come to public attent...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
We have until 16:38 for open debate. Seven members have requested to speak, which means speeches of four minutes, although I will accept extra time for inter...
Scott Barrie (Dunfermline West) (Lab):
Lab
It is now almost six years since the Children (Scotland) Act 1995 came into force, which totally updated our child protection system from the one laid out in...
Alasdair Morgan (Galloway and Upper Nithsdale) (SNP):
SNP
I will talk mainly about social work, because my experience of that is twofold. My wife is a social worker from the days when such a thing as Edinburgh Corpo...
Cathy Jamieson:
Lab
Does the member accept that the forthcoming summit, which will bring together all the agencies that are involved, is designed to deal with some of the recomm...
Alasdair Morgan:
SNP
I hope that the summit will do that. The recommendations will need to be examined hard, because if they are taken as they are, they will increase bureaucracy...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con):
Con
As the debate is important and concerns a vital subject, it is depressing that the benches are so empty. Perhaps yesterday's excitement was too much for memb...
Cathy Jamieson:
Lab
The member's colleague, Bill Aitken, has already disassociated himself from the remarks that were made by whoever issued his party's press release yesterday....
Murdo Fraser:
Con
My colleague Bill Aitken has just confirmed to me that he disassociates himself from the remarks that were made. I think that it was my colleague Brian Monte...
Scott Barrie:
Lab
Will the member give way?
Murdo Fraser:
Con
No, I am in my last minute and wish to make another point.Mr Barrie will be pleased to hear that I wish to congratulate the Executive on one particular aspec...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Mr Murray Tosh):
Con
You certainly are.
Murdo Fraser:
Con
I will just conclude with one final point.
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Con
No, there really is no time for that. I think that you have had your cut. I would be obliged if you would take your seat so that I can move on to Jackie Bail...
Murdo Fraser:
Con
Thank you, Presiding Officer.
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab):
Lab
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I am sure that that will come as a relief to other members.
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
Con
That comment was not entirely helpful.
Jackie Baillie:
Lab
I always want to be helpful. Let me return to the substance of my speech."It's everyone's job to make sure I'm alright" is not just the title of the review, ...
Colin Campbell (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
This is a topic of huge concern to every human being in the country. The fact that any child suffers physical or mental abuse, either deliberately or acciden...
Donald Gorrie (Central Scotland) (LD):
LD
I welcome the steps that the Executive has taken to try to deal better with the problem of child protection. I shall try not to rehash some of the excellent ...