Chamber
Plenary, 09 Dec 1999
09 Dec 1999 · S1 · Plenary
Item of business
Adults with Incapacity (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
A great deal of concern has also been expressed about the definition of "medical treatment" in the bill. In large part, that is linked to the definition of "intervention". The inclusion of
"ventilation, nutrition and hydration by artificial means"
in the definition of "medical treatment" has caused alarm, because the thought of proxy decision makers being empowered to refuse that aspect of treatment, thereby causing death, fuels concerns
about passive euthanasia. No matter what attempts are made to reassure those who are alarmed by that section of the bill, they have remained firmly of the view that it could well result in proxy decision makers being able to make decisions that will inevitably lead to death, with all that that implies. The requirement that an intervention be of benefit to the patient is interpreted by the critics as having no application to a refusal or failure to act. It seems to me that the absolute assurances that that will not be a result of the legislation have counted for so little thus far that we are in danger that that aspect of the debate will overshadow everything else.
I do not know whether the minister's announcements today will change that. If the intention of the drafters of the bill is that it does not authorise withdrawal of treatment, and that any such decision will still require resort to the courts, it may be that consideration should be given to spelling that out more explicitly in the legislation.
"ventilation, nutrition and hydration by artificial means"
in the definition of "medical treatment" has caused alarm, because the thought of proxy decision makers being empowered to refuse that aspect of treatment, thereby causing death, fuels concerns
about passive euthanasia. No matter what attempts are made to reassure those who are alarmed by that section of the bill, they have remained firmly of the view that it could well result in proxy decision makers being able to make decisions that will inevitably lead to death, with all that that implies. The requirement that an intervention be of benefit to the patient is interpreted by the critics as having no application to a refusal or failure to act. It seems to me that the absolute assurances that that will not be a result of the legislation have counted for so little thus far that we are in danger that that aspect of the debate will overshadow everything else.
I do not know whether the minister's announcements today will change that. If the intention of the drafters of the bill is that it does not authorise withdrawal of treatment, and that any such decision will still require resort to the courts, it may be that consideration should be given to spelling that out more explicitly in the legislation.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Mr George Reid):
SNP
We move to the next item of business, a debate on motion S1M-213, in the name of Mr Jim Wallace, which seeks the Parliament's agreement to the general princi...
The Deputy First Minister and Minister for Justice (Mr Jim Wallace):
LD
I am pleased to move this motion to approve the general principles of the Adults with Incapacity (Scotland) Bill. The bill is a major piece of law reform. It...
Mrs Margaret Ewing (Moray) (SNP):
SNP
Part of the problem that I have with the bill is the inclusion of people in discussions of how to decide to give power of attorney, for example. What does th...
Mr Wallace:
LD
Individual cases—it is important to stress that cases are considered individually—will differ according to the individual's incapacity and the particular cir...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab):
Lab
I welcome the change to section 44 and the deletion of the reference to nutrition and hydration by artificial means as a medical treatment. However, as that ...
Mr Wallace:
LD
Malcolm Chisholm is talking about situations in which there is a conflict of opinion between the doctor and the guardian on a proposed course of action. We h...
Roseanna Cunningham (Perth) (SNP):
SNP
It is only right that, as convener of the Justice and Home Affairs Committee, I take a few minutes in the chamber to comment on the committee's experience of...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
Please close.
Roseanna Cunningham:
SNP
A great deal of concern has also been expressed about the definition of "medical treatment" in the bill. In large part, that is linked to the definition of "...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
Will you close now, please?
Roseanna Cunningham:
SNP
The clock shows that I have 50 seconds left, Presiding Officer.
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
You are two minutes over.
Roseanna Cunningham:
SNP
We should recognise that many organisations feel that, whether it intends to or not, the bill will introduce euthanasia by the back door. Much of the evidenc...
Ben Wallace (North-East Scotland) (Con):
Con
I speak as the reporting member of the Health and Community Care Committee and as the deputy health spokesman for the Conservative party. When I welcome the ...
Mr Jim Wallace:
LD
I am happy to give the member that assurance.
Ben Wallace:
Con
Although we all agree with its aims, the proposed legislation throws up the ethical question of euthanasia. Despite the minister's assurances, there are part...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
I call Nora Radcliffe.
Nora Radcliffe (Gordon) (LD):
LD
I did not expect to be called.
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
You are on the list to speak for the Liberal Democrats. Do you want to speak? If not, I can open the general debate.
Nora Radcliffe:
LD
I have not prepared a speech, but I will make some remarks, wearing my equal opportunities hat. I welcome, in particular, the bill's emphasis on the rights o...
The Deputy Presiding Officer:
SNP
Contrary to expectation, we can probably fit in two general speeches before lunch. I call Richard Simpson, to be followed by Kay Ullrich.
Dr Richard Simpson (Ochil) (Lab):
Lab
The bill is to be welcomed—that is clear—but there are some problems with it. I am not sure whether the bill will last as long as the Curators Act 1585, whic...
Kay Ullrich (West of Scotland) (SNP):
SNP
As Roseanna Cunningham said, we made a commitment in our manifesto for the Scottish Parliament to support an incapable adults bill, with the proviso that the...
The Presiding Officer (Sir David Steel):
NPA
I am sorry, but the chair is in some slight confusion. The debate will be resumed this afternoon.I advise members who have indicated a wish to speak that I h...