Committee
Transport and the Environment Committee, 23 May 2000
23 May 2000 · S1 · Transport and the Environment Committee
Item of business
Refuse Collection
I am sure that if the issue of commercial premises is highlighted to local authorities, they will want to act on that. Council tax payers will not want to think that they are subsidising commercial premises whose occupants are abdicating their responsibilities.
I never thought that wheelie bins would be at the cutting edge of political debate, but I want to raise a wee issue from the report. I notice that you identified some schemes as being worthy of review on the basis that the local authorities pull out more wheelie bins from the house to the side of the road than do other authorities, instead of expecting tenants or residents to do that. The report recognises that bins may be pulled out because people are elderly or infirm, but it seems to suggest that in an effort to drive down costs, certain authorities should review that practice because the expectation is that the level of pull-outs should not exceed 5 per cent of the properties that are served.
Where did the figure of 5 per cent come from? Does it arise from anecdotal evidence? I have a horror of the idea of council officers spending their time running around assessing whether people are able to push a wheelie bin to the front of their house or of people in some areas requiring a medical certificate. Surely that would not be the best way forward for joined-up government.
On recycling, I notice that one of the recommendations of the report concerns
"making the case to councillors for an appropriate amount of council subsidy to support expensive, but environmentally desirable services".
How do we square the idea that the council and the council tax payers should subsidise that essential service with the fact that, as has been pointed out, the private sector appears not to be taking responsibility by creating a market for recycled goods?
I never thought that wheelie bins would be at the cutting edge of political debate, but I want to raise a wee issue from the report. I notice that you identified some schemes as being worthy of review on the basis that the local authorities pull out more wheelie bins from the house to the side of the road than do other authorities, instead of expecting tenants or residents to do that. The report recognises that bins may be pulled out because people are elderly or infirm, but it seems to suggest that in an effort to drive down costs, certain authorities should review that practice because the expectation is that the level of pull-outs should not exceed 5 per cent of the properties that are served.
Where did the figure of 5 per cent come from? Does it arise from anecdotal evidence? I have a horror of the idea of council officers spending their time running around assessing whether people are able to push a wheelie bin to the front of their house or of people in some areas requiring a medical certificate. Surely that would not be the best way forward for joined-up government.
On recycling, I notice that one of the recommendations of the report concerns
"making the case to councillors for an appropriate amount of council subsidy to support expensive, but environmentally desirable services".
How do we square the idea that the council and the council tax payers should subsidise that essential service with the fact that, as has been pointed out, the private sector appears not to be taking responsibility by creating a market for recycled goods?
In the same item of business
The Convener:
Lab
Item 4 on the agenda is the Audit Scotland report, which was circulated to members. We will have a discussion with Audit Scotland officials on the content of...
Mr Bill Magee (Audit Scotland):
Thank you very much, convener. I thank the committee for giving us the opportunity to come along this morning to talk about the report. I am the secretary of...
Mr Martin Christie (Audit Scotland):
In the next 10 minutes or so, I would like to take the committee through the objectives, scope, findings and recommendations of the study. I will then be hap...
The Convener:
Lab
Thank you. That was a useful talk through the report.
Janis Hughes (Glasgow Rutherglen) (Lab):
Lab
I was concerned to hear you mention that council tax payers are subsidising commercial collection to the tune of £10 million. You mention in the part of the ...
Mr Christie:
I believe that the Scottish Environment Protection Agency is the governing body that can fine people for not having an arrangement for the disposal of their ...
The Convener:
Lab
What is your view on giving local authority cleansing departments the powers to carry out enforcement? When I was a councillor in Glasgow, we encountered dif...
Mr Christie:
I am not able to express a personal view, but I am interested in initiatives that Glasgow has taken. I believe that the problem can be resolved by co-operati...
Nora Radcliffe:
LD
One of the statistics in the report is that tonnage collected by councils has risen by 14 per cent in the past 10 years. Has there been a parallel population...
Mr Christie:
I do not have information on that to hand. The rise can be related to wheelie bins, the introduction of which has led to a greater tonnage being produced by ...
Nora Radcliffe:
LD
When I was a councillor, I thought my council should have introduced wheelie bins of half the size. A 240 litre bin was used, but a smaller one was given to ...
Mr Christie:
There is currently an interest in the REMADE initiative, which is working with the private sector to develop a market for recyclables. However, it is importa...
Tavish Scott:
LD
I have a question for Mr Magee and a couple for Mr Christie.From my background in local government in Shetland, I found that your organisation was not so muc...
The Convener:
Lab
Yes.
Tavish Scott:
LD
I bow to your superior knowledge, convener.As I said, those parts of the country face higher transportation and freight costs, which means that the market fo...
Mr Magee:
It has often been said that local government's strength lies in its diversity. We recognise that fact, which is why we have the kind of constitutional arrang...
Tavish Scott:
LD
I am sure you are acutely aware of the concerns of Shetland Islands Council—and other councils—about the amount of officer time some of these exercises take....
Mr Magee:
We do not do a costing exercise on that but burdens is an issue. We talk to the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities as well as to individual councils. W...
Mr Christie:
Councils are developing area waste plans by working together. There are 11 waste plans in Scotland, which means that groups of two or three councils are work...
Tavish Scott:
LD
I am sorry to go on a bit, but I want to ask specifically about glass and paper. If those products are marketable, because there is a demand for them, how ca...
Mr Christie:
I understand that the REMADE initiative is exploring the issue of waste glass. The lessons to be learned from that exercise will be a valuable contribution t...
The Convener:
Lab
I suspect that members are bidding to join the Local Government Committee.
Linda Fabiani:
SNP
I will try to keep it short, to make up for Tavish Scott's questions. People have used words such as integration. We have these huge targets to meet and we w...
Mr Tosh:
Con
You will have passed Tavish by now.
Linda Fabiani:
SNP
I get very frustrated with all the fine talk about what people have to achieve, when there is no commitment at the top to helping everyone play their part in...
Mr Magee:
I want to avoid giving what will sound like a bureaucrat's answer, but I am afraid that, inevitably, I will fail. I accept entirely that resources are centra...
Robin Harper:
Green
It is difficult not to point out Scotland's appalling record in recycling. At 10 per cent, our best is well below the best in England, which is around 25 per...
Mr Christie:
I will leave the issue of the wheelie bins to one side for the moment. The best material that we have on the option of collecting rubbish that has been sorte...
Cathy Jamieson:
Lab
I am sure that if the issue of commercial premises is highlighted to local authorities, they will want to act on that. Council tax payers will not want to th...
Mr Christie:
I will answer those points in order. On the level of pull-outs, the evidence for the figure of 5 per cent is a wee bit more than anecdotal. We obtained that ...