Committee
Procedures Committee, 06 Mar 2007
06 Mar 2007 · S2 · Procedures Committee
Item of business
Parliamentary Time
Richard Baker is right that the previous Procedures Committee dealt with the subject before. Reports by other committees have also not been debated—it happens. Kate Maclean is right that the bureau's unpicking of the report, rather than simply choosing not to debate it, is probably unprecedented. There have been numerous cases in which committee reports have not made it to the floor of the chamber to be debated.I am not concerned that a future committee will not pick up the issues that we raised. They need to be picked up and taken forward, particularly the issues about stages 2 and 3 and the notice period for motions and amendments. It is ridiculous that we are in a position today where we are lodging amendments to motions that will be debated tomorrow. The motions are not emergency ones; they relate to policy announcements that political parties made months ago, so they could have been lodged last week. That would have enabled members to engage in a decent dialogue with their constituents and with stakeholders. That is particularly true of the debate on alcohol misuse by young people, which is a serious issue. I know that the convener has strong views on that. If we want the process to be meaningful and not stage-managed by political parties—whichever they are—we need to get the notice period for motions and amendments right.What can we do? Other members are right—we cannot do anything. The bureau has the power, and it has spoken. We need to take it on the chin and put the matter in our legacy paper. Those of us who are lucky enough to be here in the next session of Parliament can champion the matter with the next Procedures Committee. I hope to be back, but not on the Procedures Committee. Laughter.
In the same item of business
The Convener:
LD
The next item is our review of parliamentary time. Members have a paper that contains the correspondence on the subject between the committee and the Parliam...
Chris Ballance:
Green
Feel free. I have no desire for privacy.
The Convener:
LD
Chris Ballance spoke up and some others in the bureau expressed some support for us, but it was clear to me and to Andrew Mylne, who came to the meeting as a...
Kate Maclean (Dundee West) (Lab):
Lab
To a certain extent, I am fairly ambivalent about whether the report goes ahead or not, because I have not been involved in the tortuous process of compiling...
The Convener:
LD
Chris Ballance has two angles, as it were, on the issue.
Chris Ballance:
Green
Again, without breaching any of the confidences of a bureau meeting, a particular business manager argued on the one hand that MSPs hate parts of the report ...
Richard Baker (North East Scotland) (Lab):
Lab
I am perhaps more sanguine about the situation. The committee has been here before. The previous committee, of which I was not a member, held a massive inqui...
Kate Maclean:
Lab
It is the same with any committee.
Richard Baker:
Lab
Yes, that is right. Although colleagues did not grasp our report, it would have been worse had we gone to the floor of the chamber with it and found out that...
Karen Gillon:
Lab
Richard Baker is right that the previous Procedures Committee dealt with the subject before. Reports by other committees have also not been debated—it happen...
Kate Maclean:
Lab
I have a further point on something that the bureau said. If one of the criteria for getting items debated in the chamber was that members had read the relev...
Chris Ballance:
Green
I should add that there is substantial opposition from more than one business manager to the concept of giving more notice of motions. That is deeply depress...
The Convener:
LD
It is helpful to get colleagues' views. We come from slightly different angles, but we all agree that we are disappointed.The only opportunity to mention the...
Kate Maclean:
Lab
Are you suggesting that we have that debate and not push the matter to a vote?
The Convener:
LD
Whatever colleagues think. I have challenged the business motion several times in the past. Occasionally, the vote in favour of my challenge has got into dou...
Kate Maclean:
Lab
That would be 10 votes, then.
The Convener:
LD
It is, nevertheless, an opportunity for setting out a case on which members of the committee have strong feelings. I presume that the Minister for Parliament...
Chris Ballance:
Green
That is quite a good idea. The advantage of challenging the business motion is that the convener would get three minutes in which to tell the entire chamber ...
Karen Gillon:
Lab
I would be cautious about that approach, convener. It might look as though we had had a fight, lost it and were taking our ball away in a big huff. Some othe...
Kate Maclean:
Lab
Have certain committee reports not been debated because the bureau did not like their content? I cannot think of any precedent for that.
Karen Gillon:
Lab
They were never scheduled for debate by the Conveners Group, so we do not know whether it was because the bureau did not like their content. Committee busine...
The Convener:
LD
You are right to say that it would not be something to do lightly or inadvisedly. Nevertheless, if there was a brief debate and the subject was aired, that w...
Richard Baker:
Lab
It would be good to put on the record the fact that we have looked into the issues in some depth and that they should not just go away. However, I am torn as...
The Convener:
LD
If we wrote to the bureau, is there any means by which the letter could become a public paper and the figures would be on the record?
Kate Maclean:
Lab
Could we not write to the bureau and copy the letter to all members?
Richard Baker:
Lab
Why do we not do that? That would be sensible.
Kate Maclean:
Lab
We could include a copy of the Official Report of today's meeting.
Chris Ballance:
Green
It would not be on the public record in the same way.
Karen Gillon:
Lab
It is on the public record as a result of this meeting.
Kate Maclean:
Lab
To be honest, if the matter is discussed in the chamber at decision time—when there are never any members of the press there—it will not be any more on the p...