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Committee

Local Government Committee, 01 May 2001

01 May 2001 · S1 · Local Government Committee
Item of business
Non-domestic Rates
Gerry Dowds: Watch on SPTV
The third aspect of the Executive's proposals relates to the additional eligibility criteria. We believe that a properly researched relief scheme that is based on the principles that the committee set out last June should not need crude additional eligibility criteria, each of which would involve yet another threshold.We propose a £200,000 threshold for businesses. Corner shops that have very low margins cannot make a living on anything less than a turnover of £200,000. Should not they get relief?A six-employee threshold is one of the cornerstones of the paper. The owner of a café that has a £4,500 rateable value might think, "Great. I'll get the maximum relief—but hang on, I have seven part-time employees. I'll sack one to get the relief." Thresholds distort competition and restrict growth and we now have not one, but three thresholds: on rateable value, on turnover, and on employees. Why not chuck in one on the number of windows in the premises or on the number of cars the owner has? The position could not get any worse. If this is the best scheme that the Executive could come up with, God help us. Surely the devolved Parliament should mean well-researched solutions to help business. Instead, we meekly follow what is going on south of the border.It is shameful that so little time and effort has been spent on three fundamental issues, which have been ignored in the proposal. First, there has been no research into the Scottish rental position, but the relationship between rent and rates is case-proven. That has not been disputed since 1995. Therefore straight away, 50 per cent of businesses receive no relief. Secondly, there has been no investigation of the impact on town centres. Bill Anderson has already given the committee chapter and verse on that. If that is the case in Elgin, Inverness and Stirling, what about Glasgow? One can imagine what the rateable values are there. Thirdly, nobody in the civil service has helped the ministers and nobody in the Scottish Valuation and Rating Council has spent the 30 minutes that it would take to go through the valuation rolls to check out that the whole of the tourism industry might as well write off the relief. We cannot believe that those three gross errors have been made in producing the proposals.We cannot have this apology for a scheme—we need something better. We need a relief scheme that picks up the principles that the committee outlined last June. There should be a scheme that enjoys the support of the small-business community. Eighty-nine per cent of our members have rejected any scheme that is based on rateable value. We encourage the committee to ask other organisations that give evidence whether they have consulted their members by ballot on the matter. Any scheme should target relief according to the size of the business, rather than the premises, and it should avoid discriminatory thresholds. A scheme should not discriminate against tourism businesses or any other sector. The size of the business should be measured on current information. The scheme should taper relief and not shoehorn in unnecessary thresholds. The scheme should not produce unnecessary appeals and should not give relief to landlords, but not to tenants. It should be simple for the Executive, for local authorities and for businesses to apply the scheme and it should be a scheme that we can all follow reasonably well.There should be a dual-tapered scheme, as we told the committee previously. Such a scheme would make use of employers' national insurance contributions as well as rateable value or gross rates paid. The use of rates liability and national insurance produces a flat taper that ensures that any decisions that a business makes are not distorted or confused by a relief scheme.As far as implementation of such a scheme is concerned, the key stakeholders need fear nothing. First, the business owner would apply the scheme in exactly the same way as statutory sick pay is applied now. Statutory sick pay is already reimbursed—businesses claim it monthly or quarterly as a deduction from their tax and NI payments according to tables that the Inland Revenue provides. It is fully administered through the pay-as-you-earn scheme. The business owner would simply register the relevant premises with the tax office and the local authority would, on request, provide the Inland Revenue with data regarding occupancy. That also goes for the assessors. The Executive would supervise the scheme overall, and some form of adjustment of the redistribution formula would need to be applied to business rates to ensure that the national insurance fund was reimbursed by the amount of money that was paid out in business rates relief.Where would the burden of administration fall? It would fall on the Inland Revenue. We have considered the matter and discussed it with Inland Revenue officials, and we can safely say that the requirements on the Inland Revenue would all be deliverable within existing Inland Revenue structures. There would be a cost, but it would not be disproportionate to the benefit, and the cost implications fit into the existing structures.I will summarise. First, the proposed scheme does not satisfy the principles that the Local Government Committee arrived at in June—after seven months of deliberation. Secondly, it discriminates significantly against huge tranches of the small-business community in Scotland. Thirdly, there is a better alternative that follows the principles that the committee upheld.

In the same item of business

The Convener: Lab
We return to the issue of non-domestic rates for the next item on the agenda. In November 1999, the committee held a short inquiry into the revaluation of no...
Gerry Dowds (Forum of Private Business):
I thank the committee for welcoming us here today.Committee members should have received a copy of the presentation format that we would like to walk everyon...
Bill Anderson (Forum of Private Business):
The committee has a copy of the nice colour photos. The report that you were given earlier contains the black-and-white copies of the photos. We want to cons...
The Convener: Lab
Could I interrupt to say that I think that we have got the message about rateable values? Could we move on, as I am conscious of the time and of the fact tha...
Bill Anderson:
I will finish on that point.
Gerry Dowds:
The third aspect of the Executive's proposals relates to the additional eligibility criteria. We believe that a properly researched relief scheme that is bas...
The Convener: Lab
Thank you. I shall start the ball rolling, while other members decide what questions they will ask.Paragraph 1.6 of the Executive consultation paper deals wi...
Gerry Dowds:
Do you mean our scheme or the Executive's proposals?
The Convener: Lab
The Executive's proposals. Why do you suggest that they aim relief at premises, not businesses?
Gerry Dowds:
Essentially, because the Executive has chosen to determine relief based on rateable value. Rateable values are tagged to premises, not to the dynamics of the...
Mr Michael McMahon (Hamilton North and Bellshill) (Lab): Lab
In paragraphs 1.11 and 1.12 of the Scottish Executive's consultation paper, it is suggested that certain types of property, such as advertising hoardings and...
Nick Goulding (Forum of Private Business):
That depends on who owns and who operates the property, because it forms part of the overall rateable base of a business. In the vast majority of cases—almos...
Mr McMahon: Lab
So, if a small, independent business is operating beside a chain store, the turnover of the independent proprietor alone should be counted, not the overall i...
Nick Goulding:
It is not turnover that we are suggesting as an indicator, because there are specific problems in measuring turnover, which I could explain in more detail. I...
Mr McMahon: Lab
Is it possible for a company with a chain of shops to work at tight margins in every outlet, but to appear quite profitable overall? Would such a company be ...
Nick Goulding:
I understand the question, but further research would be required on the impact at the margins of that sort of business. On average, taking into account sect...
Mr Kenneth Gibson (Glasgow) (SNP): SNP
Gerry Dowds talked about the way in which landlords would benefit if the focus were on small properties, rather than on small businesses. Would that happen u...
Gerry Dowds:
No.
Mr Gibson: SNP
Why would the situation be different?
Gerry Dowds:
Our proposed scheme targets a business by using two measurements, the first of which is a true measurement of the size of the business. Any reasonable criter...
Mr Gibson: SNP
I am conversant with that argument. However, if relief were delivered under your scheme, businesses would become more prosperous. Would that tempt landlords ...
Nick Goulding:
The fundamental difference is in transparency in the property market. If the criteria on which rateable value is based are transparent in the property market...
Mr Gibson: SNP
I understand. In point 2E of your response to the Executive's consultation document, you quote the committee's report, which stated:"The Committee considers ...
Bill Anderson:
We suggest that because the Executive's scheme is not tapered. A scheme with steps continues to have the problem that going up to the next step means a step ...
Mr Gibson: SNP
Is that the point at which floods of appeals will be made?
Bill Anderson:
I have watched revaluations since 1985. People have various motivations for appealing, such as trying to reduce a valuation. For example, the Highlander Inn—...
Mr Gibson: SNP
So the scheme would be unworkable because of that sole criterion—I know that you mentioned several criteria, which I will not explore, as other members want ...
Gerry Dowds:
A taper delivers a curve, which means that decisions are not distorted, because they will have the impact of only a small incremental movement on the busines...
The Convener: Lab
Gil Paterson would like to ask a quick question.
Mr Gil Paterson (Central Scotland) (SNP): SNP
Gerry Dowds has answered my question.