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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 25 June 2026 [Draft]

25 Jun 2026 · S7 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Prison Population
Campbell, Kate SNP Edinburgh Eastern, Musselburgh and Tranent Watch on SPTV

There are many things that we need to do to tackle poverty and inequality. If Stephen Kerr agrees that poverty is an underlying factor, I hope that he will agree that, for example, the Scottish child payment is transformational. If he listens to the rest of my speech, he will hear about that.

On average, families of people in custody spend £180 a month on supporting that person. Only yesterday, we found out that one in five families are left with just £12 a week after outgoings—those are the families living with the highest levels of poverty. Those families are disproportionately more likely to be impacted by incarceration and are also more likely to be unable to afford to visit and support incarcerated family members. We have to break that cycle.

Prison still very much has a place. We need our communities to be safe. However, when prison is not necessary, and when a community sentence or home detention can be used instead, the benefits are huge. It keeps families together, keeps people rooted in their communities and makes it much less likely that the person will reoffend—because, at the end of their sentence, they are not ejected back into society without a life to return to. I am glad that, this year, the Scottish Government is investing £169 million in community justice. That is how we break the cycle.

A huge part has to be about how we prevent young people from getting caught up in the criminal justice system. That includes using peer mentoring projects, such as the turn your life around project, to help young people who may not have the role models that they need in their lives; restorative justice, which empowers victims and survivors while helping offenders to understand the impact of their crimes on other people; or trauma-informed community custody units such as the Bella centre and the Lilias centre, where women on low supervision can rebuild their lives.

We also need to take a whole-life, whole-society approach. When we consider investment in social justice, the Scottish child payment, social housing, mental health services, youth work, keeping the Promise and any other measure that reduces inequality and makes our society fairer, we must also consider that to be tackling the root causes of crime, bringing down our prison population and making our communities safer. Those are the outcomes that we all want to achieve—I hope that we can agree on that.

15:32

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S7M-00469, in the name of Neil Gray, on achieving a sustainable prison population. I invite members who wish ...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Neil Gray) SNP
On the day after my appointment as justice secretary, I visited HMP Edinburgh to see the level of pressure that the Scottish Prison Service is facing due to ...
Stephen Kerr (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I thank the cabinet secretary for giving way. He made a point about the remand population. He is quite right that one in four members of our prison populatio...
Neil Gray SNP
Stephen Kerr is correct. We have discussed that matter before, and I believe that the work that has been done on summary case management, which has sped up t...
Stephen Kerr Con
Will the cabinet secretary take this opportunity to accept, with some degree of humility, that the prison capacity situation is a direct result of the neglec...
Neil Gray SNP
I have already referenced that we are building two new prisons and that we are expanding capacity. We already have one of the highest levels of custody per h...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
Scottish Labour welcomes the opportunity to have an early discussion on the state of the Scottish prison system. There is a lot in the amendments from the ot...
Neil Gray SNP
I recognise Pauline McNeill’s long-standing commitment to looking at community alternatives to custody. Does she welcome what I am setting out to do in provi...
Pauline McNeill Lab
Yes, I do. I would like an early indication of additional investment in GPS technology. Considering all that we would need to do to provide safety for commun...
Willie Rennie (Fife North East) (LD) LD
Will the member take an intervention?
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
The member cannot take an intervention, as she is already in additional time.
Pauline McNeill Lab
I will conclude with a specific point on deaths in custody, which the Criminal Justice Committee had a brief chat about on Wednesday morning. There was a pro...
Amanda Bland (Central Scotland and Lothians West) (Reform) Reform
I thank you, cabinet secretary, and Pauline McNeill.I am interested in your proposals. We agree that the Scottish Prison Service continues to operate in cris...
Amanda Bland (Central Scotland and Lothians West) (Reform) Reform
I thank the cabinet secretary and Pauline McNeill.I am interested in your proposals. We agree that the Scottish Prison Service continues to operate in crisis...
Neil Gray SNP
I should correct the statistic that I gave. It is 8,459 not 8,549. There was a typo in the speech.
Neil Gray SNP
I should correct the statistic that I gave. It is 8,459 not 8,549. There was a typo in the speech.
Amanda Bland Reform
So, we are looking at 106 per cent overcapacity. That is one of the highest levels ever recorded. We are all in agreement that that is unsustainable, is unsa...
Amanda Bland Reform
So, we are looking at 106 per cent overcapacity. That is one of the highest levels ever recorded. We are all in agreement that that is unsustainable, is unsa...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind all members that they should always speak through the chair.15:01
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind all members that they should always speak through the chair.15:01
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
Our prison system is not working. Like so many other institutions, including our national health service and our schools, prisons reflect the society that th...
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
Our prison system is not working. Like so many other institutions, including our national health service and our schools, prisons reflect the society that th...
Mark Simpson (North East Scotland) (Reform) Reform
Will the member take an intervention?
Mark Simpson (North East Scotland) (Reform) Reform
Will the member take an intervention?
Maggie Chapman Green
No, not just now.Prison reform should allow us to do the upstream work that we know will help people to avoid prison in the first place. The Scottish Governm...
Maggie Chapman Green
No, not just now.Prison reform should allow us to do the upstream work that we know will help people to avoid prison in the first place. The Scottish Governm...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind members that there should be no interruptions or interventions during a first speech. To make his first speech, and to move and speak to amendment S...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind members that there should be no interruptions or interventions during a first speech. To make his first speech, and to move and speak to amendment S...
James Adams (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
I am proud and honoured to have been elected to represent the north-east of Scotland, the area where I was born, grew up and still proudly call home. I am de...
James Adams (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
I am proud and honoured to have been elected to represent the north-east of Scotland, the area where I was born, grew up and still proudly call home. I am de...