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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 25 June 2026 [Draft]

25 Jun 2026 · S7 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Prison Population
Chapman, Maggie Green North East Scotland Watch on SPTV

No, not just now.

Prison reform should allow us to do the upstream work that we know will help people to avoid prison in the first place. The Scottish Government’s penal policy advisers have cited evidence from the Edinburgh study of youth transitions and crime that shows that poverty, poor housing, unemployment and weak community infrastructure increase the risks of social exclusion and fuel distrust and disaffection, which ultimately increases the risk of conflict with the law. The same advisers have said that, when people do fall foul of the law, we need much more focus on early intervention pathways, because formal prosecution often escalates problems, increases stigma and limits opportunities for change.

Some people pose a significant risk of harm to society. We must have ways of preventing such harm. Indeed, harm reduction must be a cornerstone of our justice system. However, for many people—I would argue that this applies to the vast majority of those who are currently incarcerated, including women, neurodiverse people and people with mental health issues—the evidence overwhelmingly shows that prisons not only do not work but actually make things worse.

We cannot keep doing the same thing over and over again and expect different results—there is a word for that. However, we do not have to do so, because other countries have shown us the way. We must understand the socioeconomic causes of crime and tackle them accordingly. When people commit crime, we must exhaust the whole suite of approaches that work better to punish appropriately and rehabilitate before considering prisons, which most often do neither. When incarceration becomes necessary, those places must have the resources that they need to rehabilitate and genuinely help people to do better in the future. Only then can incarceration genuinely be the last resort, rather than a place where we warehouse the problems that society has chosen not to solve.

I move amendment S7M-00469.3, to leave out from second “operational” to end and insert:

“human rights and safety risks for staff and prisoners; further recognises the importance of prioritising harm reduction across the justice system; believes that incarceration should always be the last resort, once all other alternatives have been exhausted; notes that Scotland has one of the highest prison populations in western Europe, including a disproportionate remand population; acknowledges the underlying drivers, including poverty, inequality, homelessness and experience of the care system; notes that the cost per prisoner per year to the public purse is £52,200; recognises the need for effective rehabilitation to reduce offending and re-offending and to benefit the communities that individuals return to; agrees that public safety is paramount and that it is vital that victims and survivors should be at the heart of the justice system, and must be supported and have confidence in it, and agrees, therefore, that a balanced package of measures to expand effective community sentencing and other alternatives to prison, such as restorative justice, bail supervision and supported accommodation, and to enact preventative measures to stop people entering or re-entering the prison system, including sustained investment in housing, mental health services, youth work, addiction services and community support, as part of a transformative justice approach, are necessary to achieve a sustainable prison population now and in the future.”

References in this contribution

Motions, questions or amendments mentioned by their reference code.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S7M-00469, in the name of Neil Gray, on achieving a sustainable prison population. I invite members who wish ...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Neil Gray) SNP
On the day after my appointment as justice secretary, I visited HMP Edinburgh to see the level of pressure that the Scottish Prison Service is facing due to ...
Stephen Kerr (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I thank the cabinet secretary for giving way. He made a point about the remand population. He is quite right that one in four members of our prison populatio...
Neil Gray SNP
Stephen Kerr is correct. We have discussed that matter before, and I believe that the work that has been done on summary case management, which has sped up t...
Stephen Kerr Con
Will the cabinet secretary take this opportunity to accept, with some degree of humility, that the prison capacity situation is a direct result of the neglec...
Neil Gray SNP
I have already referenced that we are building two new prisons and that we are expanding capacity. We already have one of the highest levels of custody per h...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
Scottish Labour welcomes the opportunity to have an early discussion on the state of the Scottish prison system. There is a lot in the amendments from the ot...
Neil Gray SNP
I recognise Pauline McNeill’s long-standing commitment to looking at community alternatives to custody. Does she welcome what I am setting out to do in provi...
Pauline McNeill Lab
Yes, I do. I would like an early indication of additional investment in GPS technology. Considering all that we would need to do to provide safety for commun...
Willie Rennie (Fife North East) (LD) LD
Will the member take an intervention?
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
The member cannot take an intervention, as she is already in additional time.
Pauline McNeill Lab
I will conclude with a specific point on deaths in custody, which the Criminal Justice Committee had a brief chat about on Wednesday morning. There was a pro...
Amanda Bland (Central Scotland and Lothians West) (Reform) Reform
I thank you, cabinet secretary, and Pauline McNeill.I am interested in your proposals. We agree that the Scottish Prison Service continues to operate in cris...
Amanda Bland (Central Scotland and Lothians West) (Reform) Reform
I thank the cabinet secretary and Pauline McNeill.I am interested in your proposals. We agree that the Scottish Prison Service continues to operate in crisis...
Neil Gray SNP
I should correct the statistic that I gave. It is 8,459 not 8,549. There was a typo in the speech.
Neil Gray SNP
I should correct the statistic that I gave. It is 8,459 not 8,549. There was a typo in the speech.
Amanda Bland Reform
So, we are looking at 106 per cent overcapacity. That is one of the highest levels ever recorded. We are all in agreement that that is unsustainable, is unsa...
Amanda Bland Reform
So, we are looking at 106 per cent overcapacity. That is one of the highest levels ever recorded. We are all in agreement that that is unsustainable, is unsa...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind all members that they should always speak through the chair.15:01
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind all members that they should always speak through the chair.15:01
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
Our prison system is not working. Like so many other institutions, including our national health service and our schools, prisons reflect the society that th...
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
Our prison system is not working. Like so many other institutions, including our national health service and our schools, prisons reflect the society that th...
Mark Simpson (North East Scotland) (Reform) Reform
Will the member take an intervention?
Mark Simpson (North East Scotland) (Reform) Reform
Will the member take an intervention?
Maggie Chapman Green
No, not just now.Prison reform should allow us to do the upstream work that we know will help people to avoid prison in the first place. The Scottish Governm...
Maggie Chapman Green
No, not just now.Prison reform should allow us to do the upstream work that we know will help people to avoid prison in the first place. The Scottish Governm...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind members that there should be no interruptions or interventions during a first speech. To make his first speech, and to move and speak to amendment S...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Katy Clark) Lab
I remind members that there should be no interruptions or interventions during a first speech. To make his first speech, and to move and speak to amendment S...
James Adams (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
I am proud and honoured to have been elected to represent the north-east of Scotland, the area where I was born, grew up and still proudly call home. I am de...
James Adams (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
I am proud and honoured to have been elected to represent the north-east of Scotland, the area where I was born, grew up and still proudly call home. I am de...