Hansard

The Convener (Douglas Ross) Con

Good morning and welcome to the eighth meeting of the Education, Children and Young People Committee in 2026. Our first item of business is an evidence sessi...

Professor Alexis Jay (National Child Sexual Abuse and Exploitation Strategic Group)

I will start with the easier part, which is the question about what grooming is. You will be aware that my personal preference is not to use the term “groomi...

The Convener Con

We might come on to that, but it is a useful scene setter for what we will discuss. Obviously, there will be a statement in the Parliament later today, and t...

Professor Jay

Yes, I do.

The Convener Con

I will come to you, Mr Naylor. Is the inspectorate partly responsible? You are now part of this review but, prior to that, the inspectorate was there to give...

Craig Naylor (HM Inspectorate of Constabulary in Scotland)

That is a very interesting question. If you are asking whether we are responsible for this, no, we are not responsible for it.

The Convener Con

I understand that point. Could issues have been spotted sooner if the inspectorates were more concentrated on the issue, or do you think that it was impossib...

Craig Naylor

It might be worth explaining the work that we do around children and young people and adults with support needs—I will focus on children because of this comm...

The Convener Con

Initial child social work assessment meetings in 2023-24, which is just in the past couple of years, suggested that there were 13 cases of organised child se...

Craig Naylor

I do not know what information you are quoting from.

The Convener Con

Child social work assessment meetings found that there were 13 reported cases of organised child sexual abuse and exploitation identified at those meetings b...

Craig Naylor

Perhaps I did not make it clear: I do not recognise the information that you are talking about, and I do not know which document it has come from. If it is a...

The Convener Con

I am asking about the number.

Craig Naylor

Can I answer the question?The number seems very low, but on how sexual crime is reported, which is a matter for my colleagues to the right, we did an inspect...

The Convener Con

Before I move on, you have made it clear that you are staunchly independent of the Government. So that you can get your response on the record, I put it to y...

Craig Naylor

We have to use the infrastructure, which includes information technology systems that are on the Government’s network and buildings that are provided to us, ...

The Convener Con

My next question is for our Police Scotland colleagues. There is concern that incidents have been missed, whether that relates to how they are reported, reco...

Deputy Chief Constable Bex Smith (Police Scotland)

I will start and add a few thoughts. It is really important to note that we have a multi-agency approach to child abuse. We cannot work alone and we have goo...

The Convener Con

You have suggested that things have not been investigated appropriately in the past as they would be now. I will not go into the specifics of the case, but I...

Deputy Chief Constable Smith

I do not think that it would be appropriate to talk about individual cases. The convener is aware that we have agreed to meet the family in question. There w...

Detective Chief Superintendent Sarah Taylor (Police Scotland)

I whole-heartedly agree with the deputy chief constable. The important thing is transparency and I appreciate that there will be concerns around how we look ...

The Convener Con

Professor Jay, when you appeared before our committee in December, you said that the one issue that your group had“not yet properly clarified is engagement w...

Professor Jay

The point that I made was that we had not resolved how best to become involved and it was a priority for the first meeting of the group, in January of this y...

The Convener Con

Mr Naylor, I was looking at the three phases of work on the review. At what point do survivors feature in that, or is that aspect being covered by Police Sco...

Craig Naylor

We are looking at the processes and how the bodies work together to make sure that, when someone comes forward and reports, they are given the support that t...

The Convener Con

DCS Taylor, you have touched on some of the interaction that you will have with victims and survivors. Is there anything that you want to add?

Detective Chief Superintendent Taylor

Obviously, every survivor is unique. Each one has their own experiences. I want to give the reassurance that we will tailor our approach to the individual’s ...

The Convener Con

Thank you. We go to Bill Kidd.

Bill Kidd (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) SNP

This is an incredibly serious issue. What concerns are there about cross-border group-based child sexual abuse, and how are those concerns already being addr...

Professor Jay

Others will probably have a more technical answer, but I will tell you what I know from my experience, although it is not backed up with figures. I am aware ...