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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 17 February 2026 [Draft]

17 Feb 2026 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
Johnson, Daniel Lab Edinburgh Southern Watch on SPTV

Patrick Harvie, in summing up, poured a bit of scorn on those who like to claim that the Scottish Government wants to be secretive or to sit on information. I gently say to him that that is almost certainly what a former minister would say, if I can be somewhat impish.

However, Patrick Harvie made a number of good remarks, and his point that, overall, there is a consensus about the need for reform and to update the legislation on freedom of information is absolutely correct. In that context, Katy Clark is to be congratulated on taking forward a bill that is not only important but very technical and not trivial in any respect. She deserves a great deal of credit for that, and I also thank the committee for its work.

At the heart of the matter is the question of what kind of Parliament, politics and Government we want, what we claim that we have and what we really have.

I think that the two most important contributions this afternoon came from Jamie Greene and Richard Leonard. Jamie Greene highlighted the reality for those who seek to gain information through freedom of information legislation. To be frank, most people find it a battle, given the constant stream of reasons why information cannot be revealed, and the swathes of paper; we are not allowed props in the chamber, but I caught a glimpse of what Jamie Greene was holding up. Huge amounts of toner are wasted on redactions for those who seek to print out documents. That is not good enough. To be frank, the FOI regime is in a state that means that people are losing trust because of the secrecy and the reluctance to divulge information.

Richard Leonard was absolutely right that it is about principle—in my view, two very important principles. The first leads directly to democracy itself. If we seek to have democracy, we must have openness and transparency, because after all, this is the public’s money: the money that they entrust to us to spend wisely. The only way in which the public can have trust and confidence is if they have clear transparency and openness on how that money is being spent.

Just as important is the question of how Government makes decisions on our behalf: how it understands those principles, the reasons and the information, and the way in which those decisions are being made. It is not just about secrecy; it is about good decision making. The ferries fiasco shines a great deal of light on that. The fact that it transpired that email chains were being used as evidence of decision making, with second-hand accounts of conversations being held with ministers, is not good enough, and we have to shine a light on poor decision making like that.

I commend the approach that has been taken in the bill—first, to follow the money, as it were, because, where public money is being spent, whether by the public or private sectors, we have to have accountability, and there has to be a presumption of disclosure. We must have frameworks that seek to proactively disclose information and remove exemptions, caveats and vetoes. That has to be the right way to proceed.

Today, it looks as though the Government may prevail in not allowing the bill to proceed, and that will be a great shame. The question for Parliament is how we want to proceed, because this work must proceed. I think that it would be an error for members to vote against the bill this afternoon. There may be a great deal of detail to be worked out, but at least it would be progress and something to be taken up by the next Parliament.

I do not believe that the Scottish Government is necessarily the best body to take the work forward. Parliament needs to think about how we could take it forward collectively on a cross-party basis. Ultimately, this is about scrutiny and accountability, and that is the business of Parliament. That is how I think that the work should be approached in the next session of Parliament, if the bill does not proceed today.

However, we have an opportunity to take this work forward and we all agree that it should be taken forward, so I urge members to vote for the bill at stage 1 this evening.

15:21

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Alison Johnstone) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-20815, in the name of Katy Clark, on the Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill at stage 1. I call...
Katy Clark (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
It is almost 25 years since the passing of the Freedom of Information (Scotland) Act 2002, also known as FOISA. My bill is not a criticism of that act, which...
Graham Simpson (Central Scotland) (Reform) Reform
Does Katy Clark agree that the Government could have taken on the bill, as it could with any member’s bill? It chose not to, which shows that it has no appet...
Katy Clark Lab
I fully agree with that.The committee backed bringing companies that are jointly owned by the Scottish Government and other bodies into the scope of freedom ...
Sue Webber (Lothian) (Con) Con
Freedom of information is not an abstract constitutional principle; it is the cornerstone of public trust in Scotland’s institutions, and it is how people un...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I rise as convener of the Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee. I thank everyone who contributed to the committee’s scrutiny of the bill a...
The Minister for Parliamentary Business and Veterans (Graeme Dey) SNP
In the extremely limited time that I have at my disposal, I will begin by acknowledging the significant contribution that Katy Clark has made to the debate o...
Graham Simpson Reform
Will the minister take an intervention?
Graeme Dey SNP
Very briefly—if I get my time back, Presiding Officer.
Graham Simpson Reform
Does the minister agree that the Parliament is not being asked to decide whether there is enough time to get the bill through? It is being asked to decide wh...
Graeme Dey SNP
I am sure that Mr Simpson has been listening. If he listened to the points made by Sue Webber and the convener about the many issues with the bill, he would ...
Richard Leonard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lab
It was the great French philosopher and civil rights campaigner Voltaire who warned:“Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good”,and that is the crime th...
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green) Green
It would not be a Richard Leonard speech if it did not begin with a quotation from a great philosopher. If I am lucky enough to be returned in the election I...
Sue Webber Con
Will Patrick Harvie give way?
Patrick Harvie Green
I am afraid that I do not have time.My party will make clear commitments. It is incumbent on every political party, including the SNP, to make clear commitme...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (LD) LD
When trust in politics is pretty much at an all-time low, we should all be doing everything that we can to gain back that trust. It is a really bad look for ...
Sue Webber Con
Will the member accept an intervention?
Jamie Greene LD
I just do not have time unless I can get it back, and I can see the Deputy Presiding Officer giving me a no to that.I appreciate that Parliament will not hav...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
We now move to the open debate.15:01
George Adam (Paisley) (SNP) SNP
I thank Katy Clark for the way that she has gone about the business of progressing her member’s bill.Trying to sum up my thoughts on FOI in four minutes will...
Mercedes Villalba (North East Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I begin by thanking my friend and comrade Katy Clark for taking up the challenge of reforming our freedom of information laws to be fit for the 21st century....
Sue Webber Con
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. In her remarks, the member stated that Lothian Buses is owned by the council in Edinburgh. She may want to correct th...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
Thank you. That is not a point of order, but it is on the record.15:09
Graham Simpson (Central Scotland) (Reform) Reform
I congratulate Katy Clark on getting the bill to this stage, but I have to say that I feel for her after what she must have thought was quite a negative repo...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
We move to closing speeches. I call Patrick Harvie, who has up to four minutes.15:13
Patrick Harvie Green
I may not use all of that time, Presiding Officer. I am not sure that I have a huge amount more to add beyond what I said in my opening speech, but I will re...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Patrick Harvie, in summing up, poured a bit of scorn on those who like to claim that the Scottish Government wants to be secretive or to sit on information. ...
Annie Wells (Glasgow) (Con) Con
When people submit a freedom of information request, they are not making a political statement. They are usually asking something very ordinary, such as, “Wh...
Graeme Dey SNP
I thank all members who have contributed to the debate this afternoon, whether I have entirely or partially agreed or disagreed with them.Richard Leonard mad...
Daniel Johnson Lab
I note that committee members are encouraged to leave their party hats at the door. That point notwithstanding, we are, as always, being asked to consider th...