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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 25 November 2025

25 Nov 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
Adam, Karen SNP Banffshire and Buchan Coast Watch on SPTV

It is not a committee bill—it is a Scottish Government bill. We had a great deal of discussion on the age at which a child could have capacity, but the majority of us decided that teachers deal with such things all the time and have to make those kinds of decisions.

Another concern that was presented to the committee was that part 1 of the bill has been drafted as an amendment to existing pre-devolution legislation rather than as stand-alone legislation and that, as a result, the bill is not within the scope of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Act 2024. A majority of the committee was disappointed by the approach that has been taken. It would have been preferable for the bill to have been drafted as stand-alone legislation. Stakeholders have recommended that the bill be amended to bring it within the scope of the 2024 act. The committee acknowledges that an amendment of that significance might not be admissible, but we would nonetheless welcome the cabinet secretary’s reflections on that concern.

Turning to part 2, I note that the bill seeks to amend the 2024 act in order to add an exception to the duty on public authorities under section 6 of that legislation to act compatibly with the UNCRC in circumstances where the authority is compelled to act incompatibly in reliance on another act of the Scottish Parliament. The Scottish Government explained that that is intended to remove the potential for public authorities to have to decide whether to act in a way that puts them in breach of the compatibility duty in the 2024 act or another statutory duty.

Stakeholders were concerned about the implications of part 2 and perplexed about the rationale for it. It is unclear to the committee why part 2 is essential at this juncture, given that a scoping exercise has not been undertaken to understand whether there is a need for it. We note that the Children and Young People’s Commissioner Scotland has proposed mitigations to part 2, and we invite the Scottish Government to reflect further on those.

The committee is concerned, too, about the precedent that that approach sets in establishing carve-outs from legislation. We ask that, should the bill be passed, the Scottish Government ensures that Parliament is kept updated about the operation of that provision and how it may be used.

As I noted in my opening remarks, after careful consideration, a majority of the committee agreed to recommend to Parliament that it should agree to the general principles of the bill. It should be recognised that that support is predicated on amendments being made to the bill to respond to the concerns that I have outlined this afternoon. I look forward to listening to the remainder of the debate and seeking to work towards a bill that can further the rights of children effectively.

14:46  

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Alison Johnstone) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-19866, in the name of Jenny Gilruth, on the Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment o...
The Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (Jenny Gilruth) SNP
I am pleased to present the Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill. The bill is an importan...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
Liberal Democrats will support the bill tonight, but we share the considerable concerns of stakeholders in the chamber and beyond it about part 2 and the Gov...
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I will come on to talk about part 2 later, but I recognise that there are a number of different views, particularly about part 2 and on stakeholders’ views. ...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary give way?
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
Will the cabinet secretary give way?
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I am happy to give way to Mr Whitfield.
Martin Whitfield Lab
I am grateful to the cabinet secretary, given the plethora of choice that she had. The cabinet secretary has already spoken about the complexity between edu...
Jenny Gilruth SNP
The Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee raised and reported on that point. The 1980 act does not currently separate those two distinct parts...
Stephen Kerr Con
If we could go back to the issue of the rights of the child for a moment, I understand that that is a focus of the cabinet secretary’s speech, but she said t...
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I do not necessarily follow Mr Kerr’s line of questioning. The amendment to the 1980 act that is being proposed does not allow children an independent right ...
Martin Whitfield Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I am mindful of the time, Presiding Officer, but I will do so.
Martin Whitfield Lab
I am grateful to the cabinet secretary for giving so much time to interventions. Does the Scottish Government recognise that the potential of the exemption t...
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I thank Mr Whitfield for his question. In relation to the exemption being replicated in other legislation, it is important to note that a similar safeguard a...
Alex Cole-Hamilton LD
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I would like to make some progress, but I am happy to take interventions in closing. Those organisations, as well as children and young people, have been br...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I call Karen Adam, on behalf of the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee. 14:37
Karen Adam (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to speak on the bill in my capacity as convener of the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee. It is a short bill wi...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind) Ind
The member is linking religious observance and religious education, but questions have previously been raised about that. Did the committee look at that poin...
Karen Adam SNP
I will come to that point in my speech. The difference between religious observance and religious and moral education did come up in committee.
Stephen Kerr Con
The convener said that there is little or no data on withdrawals. Did the committee have any concerns about that? Why would we legislate in an area on which ...
Karen Adam SNP
We did not doubt that withdrawal is happening—there is evidence that it is. I was referring to the specific and particular data that we wanted to see in orde...
Alex Cole-Hamilton LD
Does Karen Adam recognise that capacity is defined in several different age brackets by various acts of this Parliament? I have sought to clarify that and br...
Karen Adam SNP
It is not a committee bill—it is a Scottish Government bill. We had a great deal of discussion on the age at which a child could have capacity, but the major...
Miles Briggs (Lothian) (Con) Con
The cabinet secretary opened her comments by saying that the issue is finely balanced and sensitive and that the Government has looked for a middle route. Ho...
Jenny Gilruth SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Miles Briggs Con
I will.
Jenny Gilruth SNP
I am interested in Mr Briggs’s point, because our approach maintains that only parents may initiate a withdrawal from RO or RME. Mr Briggs also mentioned con...
Miles Briggs Con
I do not disagree with some of the points that the cabinet secretary has made. The issue is about balance. Earlier, she outlined a system of opt-in and opt-o...