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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 09 December 2025

09 Dec 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Ferguson Marine (Port Glasgow) Holdings Limited
Mountain, Edward Con Highlands and Islands Watch on SPTV

Thank you very much, Presiding Officer. I will try to stick to my time, as the other speakers have.

I congratulate the Public Audit Committee on its detailed report. I do not recognise all the things that the convener said in his speech from the report, but the majority of them are there. I am delighted to see the forensic approach that has been taken by the committee, including my ex-colleague Jamie Greene, who was with me on the Rural Economy and Connectivity Committee and has spent as much time as I have looking at the ferries. He and I, as well as this Parliament, have survived four chief executive officers, four chairs, seven cabinet secretaries and 10 ministers—quite a number, in other words.

Where are we now? As the Public Audit Committee has reported, we are with a yard with no orders; a yard that, going by the evidence that we have been given on the way that it is structured, is going to need 25 to 30 per cent more money to produce a ferry than any other yard in the world; and a yard that needs about £14.2 million invested—I will come back to that last point, because at one stage we heard that it would be £25 million, so there seems to have been a bit of a reduction.

How have we got here? It is quite clear that there has been Government incompetence and management incompetence, and there is now no confidence from people who want to order ferries.

The Government incompetence goes back many years. First, who would award a contract to a company with no proven management experience in shipbuilding? I acknowledge that there might have been great experience among the workers, but the management of the yard would never have built a ship in their lives. Secondly, the Government allowed two ferries to be built at a yard that could not house two ferries, despite the fact that, as part of the contract, they had to be built at the same time. If that is not incompetence, I do not know what it is.

Then we got the arrangement of 15 staged payments for each of the ferries. What a great idea. Most yards across the world ask for five, but because the Government was keen to ensure that the person running the yard got as much support as possible, it agreed to 15 staged payments, and then managed to pay £82.5 million of the £97 million contract value when less than one ferry was built. That is incompetence.

What did we do then? When we got the yard into private ownership, we appointed Tim Hare to be the turnaround director. I know for a fact that, if you are a good turnaround director, you are never out of work. Well, Tim was the only one who was available. I also know that, if you are the turnaround director and you are six months into your job, you are no longer the solution to the problem—you are the problem. That was proved by the fact that, when he left, he had taken a huge amount of money from the Government and had not done much to turn the yard around.

We then got to the situation with the chair—I was amused by the convener’s comments about this. The Government appointed a chair to run Ferguson Marine who had never built a boat in his life. He had pretty incompetently run Prestwick airport, and he gave speeches to the committee, which I heard a number of times and which I did not understand. They seemed to be a series of jargon-speak joined together into paragraphs that did not make any sense. Perhaps it was a code that the Government understood, but, as a human being, I could not understand it, so I am with the convener on that.

Where are we now? We have a yard with no orders. Western Ferries has taken its order and given it to Cammell Laird, and even the Government has turned the yard down, taking its orders to Turkey and Poland.

What we do not know at this stage, and what the Government has never come clean about, which I find quite bizarre, is what the unrecoverable costs of running the yard are. How much does it cost to keep the lights on, to pay the rates and to run the electricity in the yard? We do not know, but no more money is going to be paid for the ferries. We have been told that the yard has had all the money that it is going to get, apart from some contingency funds. So, apparently, the money that the yard has—although I do not see it in any bank account—is mythically going to multiply to cover its running costs until it gets a new order. I hope that the Government will tell us about that.

The Labour Party is calling for another £14.2 million to be invested in the yard.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-20036, in the name of Richard Leonard, on behalf of the Public Audit Committee, on its report, “The 2023/...
Richard Leonard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I remind members of my voluntary register of trade union interests. I present this unanimous report to Parliament on behalf of the Public Audit Committee, a...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I call Daniel Johnson to speak to and move amendment S6M-20036.1. 15:20
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
The report by Audit Scotland and the subsequent report by the Public Audit Committee are stark and emphatic, and Richard Leonard’s words emphasised that. We ...
Stuart McMillan (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Daniel Johnson Lab
I will do in a moment. There is not just a financial story to be told—the Government and, indeed, all of us have a moral responsibility to ensure that the i...
Stuart McMillan SNP
With regard to reputational damage, would Daniel Johnson also acknowledge the fact that the yard went into liquidation in 2014? Clearly, the reputation of th...
Daniel Johnson Lab
What has happened since then? A £400 million bill is being picked up by the taxpayer—that is on the Scottish Government. We all know that, beyond the Glen R...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Gaelic (Kate Forbes) SNP
To use his word, the member talked about the “politicisation” of the award—I assume that he means back in 2015. He now wants us to break subsidy control and ...
Daniel Johnson Lab
The Subsidy Control Act 2022 is clear—this has not changed since 2014—that there are several criteria that can be used, including local context and social va...
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Daniel Johnson Lab
If it is brief.
Paul Sweeney Lab
I am sure that my friend would also note that, unlike in Scotland, the Polish Government offers generous patient finance to Polish shipbuilders through its s...
Daniel Johnson Lab
That is a point worth noting. The United Kingdom Labour Government has committed to reviewing UK procurement legislation to boost domestic supply chains and...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Gaelic (Kate Forbes) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to open this debate for the Government and to respond to the Public Audit Committee’s report on the 2023-24 audit of Ferguson Marin...
Craig Hoy (South Scotland) (Con) Con
Will the Deputy First Minister give way?
Kate Forbes SNP
I ask Craig Hoy to allow me to make a bit more progress, and then I will be more than happy to take his intervention. We want Ferguson Marine to be capable ...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (LD) LD
Will the Deputy First Minister take an intervention?
Daniel Johnson Lab
Will the Deputy First Minister give way?
Kate Forbes SNP
I do not know whether Craig Hoy wants to come in at this point.
Craig Hoy Con
The minister is painting a rosy picture of the situation now that borders on recklessness and complacency. Is it not the truth that this has been a fiasco in...
Kate Forbes SNP
Craig Hoy was not listening if he thinks that I was painting a rosy picture in my comments a few minutes ago. Let me turn to the delivery of the MV Glen Ros...
Daniel Johnson Lab
Made a request to intervene.
Kate Forbes SNP
I ask the member to let me get through my points and, if I have some time, I will bring him in. Lessons from the MV Glen Sannox are being applied to the MV ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I call Edward Mountain. You have around five minutes, Mr Mountain. 15:35
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
Thank you very much, Presiding Officer. I will try to stick to my time, as the other speakers have. I congratulate the Public Audit Committee on its detaile...
Daniel Johnson Lab
It is not extra.
Edward Mountain Con
It is an extra £14.2 million, because, as Mr Johnson will remember, we gave the yard £30 million—well, Derek Mackay did, without telling the Parliament or th...
Daniel Johnson Lab
Made a request to intervene.
Edward Mountain Con
I cannot take an intervention from Mr Johnson unless the Presiding Officer will let me. I am coming to a conclusion. The people of Scotland are being asked ...