Committee
Rural Affairs and Islands Committee 03 December 2025
03 Dec 2025 · S6 · Rural Affairs and Islands Committee
Item of business
Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2
Our remaining agenda item is consideration of the Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill at stage 2. As we have quite a few groups to get through, I ask everyone to be as succinct as possible when speaking to their amendments. I welcome back Mairi Gougeon, Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs, Land Reform and Islands, who is supported by Scottish Government officials, and I welcome other members who are participating in stage 2. Officials seated at the table are here to support the cabinet secretary but are not permitted to speak in the debates on amendments.
As we have a member participating remotely, I will briefly explain the procedure for hybrid stage 2 proceedings. If at any stage we lose connection, we will suspend proceedings. Emma Roddick’s camera will be kept on at all times, and she should raise her hand at the appropriate point for each vote.
Section 5—Aims of National Parks
In the same item of business
The Convener
Con
Our remaining agenda item is consideration of the Natural Environment (Scotland) Bill at stage 2. As we have quite a few groups to get through, I ask everyon...
The Convener
Con
Amendment 201, in the name of Ross Greer, is grouped with amendments 122, 314, 61, 123, 202 to 204, 62, 124, 206, 63, 315, 64, 65, 207, 208, 316, 126, 127, 3...
Mark Ruskell
Green
As members know, I am standing in for Ariane Burgess, so I will speak to her amendments, Ross Greer’s amendments—because he is at the Education, Children and...
Sarah Boyack (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
Part 3 of the bill provides a welcome opportunity for us to update Scotland’s national parks so that they can better respond to our nature and climate crises...
The Convener
Con
We will support Sarah Boyack’s amendments. Does she agree that, had those aims been in the original act, the issues and concerns—about housing, employment an...
Sarah Boyack
Lab
That is the point that I was making in relation to lessons to be learned. When we established the first national parks, making sure that people could afford ...
Tim Eagle
Con
I now have to try to argue that my amendment is stronger—we will see how we get on. Part 3 of the bill outlines the aims of national parks. My amendments 31...
The Convener
Con
I call the cabinet secretary to speak to amendment 61 and other amendments in the group.
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
There are a number of amendments in the group, and I will work through them as best I can. Although I understand the rationale for Ross Greer’s amendment 20...
Sarah Boyack
Lab
Could you give us an example of the kind of problem that you think might be created? We are looking for joined-up thinking that supports communities, individ...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I absolutely agree with that. I will have to follow up with a specific example of what that could look like. We have tried to strike the right balance in the...
Mark Ruskell
Green
I am thinking about the primacy of the national park plan. If public bodies are engaging in the national park plan, surely they are actively furthering that ...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
However, there could be conflict in the future. I agree with what you say about how public bodies interact with the parks and park plans, and there is close ...
Rhoda Grant
Lab
I understand the point about security issues, but it seems a bit strange that there is not at least an email address from which board members could pick up t...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
Again, all that that would do is add more pressure to the way that the system is handled. Potentially, those addresses would still be centrally monitored, wh...
Rhoda Grant
Lab
I am not suggesting that it would be an official park email address. It would be an individual email address in the same way as we all have email addresses i...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I have not heard from the boards that they would seek to have that arrangement. I believe that the parks are broadly content with how correspondence is manag...
Mark Ruskell
Green
These are not new issues. The cabinet secretary might recall that there was much debate about setting the boundary of the Cairngorms national park. In fact, ...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I appreciate what you set out and the genesis of the amendment, but I have to be clear that this just has not featured among the issues that have been raised...
The Convener
Con
I call Mark Ruskell, on behalf of Ross Greer, to wind up and to press or withdraw amendment 201.
Mark Ruskell
Green
This is a huge group of amendments that cover so many different issues, and it is very difficult to unpack them all in a single debate. Sarah Boyack perhaps ...
Sarah Boyack
Lab
That is a really important issue. We do not want public bodies cutting across national park plans. We want the national park plans to reflect the views of ot...
Mark Ruskell
Green
That was very well put. It cuts both ways: the park plans need to reflect the wider public objectives that public authorities are working towards, but they a...
The Convener
Con
The question is, that amendment 201 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
Con
There will be a division. For Carson, Finlay (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Eagle, Tim (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Isla...
The Convener
Con
The result of the division is: For 4, Against 5, Abstentions 0. Amendment 201 disagreed to. Amendments 122 and 314 not moved.
The Convener
Con
I remind members that, if amendment 61 is agreed to, I cannot call amendment 123 due to pre-emption. Amendment 61 moved—Mairi Gougeon.
The Convener
Con
The question is, that amendment 61 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
Con
There will be a division. For Allan, Alasdair (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) Grant, Rhoda (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Harper, Emma (South Scotland) (SNP)...
The Convener
Con
The result of the division is: For 7, Against 2, Abstentions 0. Amendment 61 agreed to. Amendments 202 to 204 not moved. Amendment 205 moved—Tim Eagle.