Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 25 September 2025
25 Sep 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Tertiary Education and Training (Funding and Governance) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
I welcome the minister to his role, as I did on Tuesday.
I also thank Graeme Dey for his constructive work on the bill both cross party and with the Education, Children and Young People Committee, and I wish him well in his new role. I also thank the organisations that have provided useful briefings ahead of today’s debate.
On Monday, I visited Leith academy. I know that the minister, as the constituency member, is a regular visitor, too. I enjoyed a tour of the school and a very constructive conversation with the headteacher, Mike Irving. I believe that the cabinet secretary is also visiting the school next week—
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing)
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-19027, in the name of Ben Macpherson, on the Tertiary Education and Training (Funding and Governance) (Sc...
The Minister for Higher and Further Education (Ben Macpherson)
SNP
I am pleased to open today’s debate on the Tertiary Education and Training (Funding and Governance) (Scotland) Bill as my first contribution to parliamentary...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD)
LD
I welcome Ben Macpherson to his new role. When he met Dr Liz Cameron from the Scottish Chambers of Commerce, did she express her strong opposition to the bil...
Ben Macpherson
SNP
My engagement with the Chambers of Commerce and with Dr Liz Cameron has been extensive over my years as an MSP, and I respect her and the organisation very m...
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
Does the minister accept that Universities Scotland and others have said that those changes could happen now, and that there is money associated with the bil...
Ben Macpherson
SNP
I was pleased to speak with Universities Scotland yesterday, and I was pleased to see the support for the bill that it issued in advance of today’s debate.
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
Will the member give way?
Ben Macpherson
SNP
I need to make some progress, but thank you. At its core, the bill intends to make impactful changes to ensure that funding goes directly to where it matter...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (Ind)
Ind
Will the minister give way?
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
The minister should be starting to conclude his remarks.
Ben Macpherson
SNP
We want to consider what improvements can be made to the range of different models for vocational pathways so that we can build on good practice and protect ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I call Douglas Ross to speak on behalf of the Education, Children and Young People Committee. 15:07
Douglas Ross (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
I am grateful for the opportunity to speak on behalf of the Education, Children and Young People Committee about our scrutiny of the Tertiary Education and T...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I call on Miles Briggs to open on behalf of the Scottish Conservatives. 15:15
Miles Briggs (Lothian) (Con)
Con
I welcome the minister to his role, as I did on Tuesday. I also thank Graeme Dey for his constructive work on the bill both cross party and with the Educati...
The Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (Jenny Gilruth)
SNP
This morning.
Miles Briggs
Con
Oh—this morning. The work that the school is undertaking with young people in that part of the capital—especially those with attendance challenges—is exempl...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab)
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Miles Briggs
Con
Yes, very briefly.
Daniel Johnson
Lab
Although some sectors might well value the delivery of the skills system through alternative provision, specifically private provision, is there not also a r...
Miles Briggs
Con
Yes, and I will come on to that. That is, as the committee highlighted, one of the main concerns. According to Audit Scotland’s report “Scotland’s colleges ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I call Pam Duncan-Glancy to open on behalf of Scottish Labour. 15:22
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
We have a proud history of skills in Scotland. Our people are among the most talented in the world, and we punch above our weight when it comes to our contri...
Ben Macpherson
SNP
As I outlined in my opening remarks, there is a shared understanding that, across the chamber, we need to make improvements throughout the country. Does the ...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I welcome the minister’s intervention. Forgive me, but I should have started by welcoming him to his place and congratulating him again on his new role. Of ...
Ben Macpherson
SNP
Made a request to intervene.
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
Presiding Officer, do I have time to take an intervention?
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I can give you a bit of time back.
Ben Macpherson
SNP
It would be helpful for me at this juncture to understand whether the parties that are opposing the bill today have a determination to work with the proposed...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
We are, of course, always happy to work with members across the chamber during the progress of any bill and to improve any piece of legislation. We will not ...