Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 24 June 2025 [Draft]
24 Jun 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Education (Scotland) Bill: Stage 3
The process has been constructive. It is a good example of how committees can work well together.
We have come to an issue that is not central to the reforms that were proposed at the beginning, which, I remind the member, were about separating the inspection function from Education Scotland and creating a new qualifications body. Accreditation was not the big issue that it has become now. Ken Muir’s report referred to it, but only as a narrow aspect of that report, and the accreditation issue mostly affects post-school vocational qualifications.
My amendments today, with agreement from the Government, will lead to a more substantial review that will have a much more expansive approach. There was no consensus on the scope or location of the accreditation function that is currently provided by the SQA. The accreditation function largely covers post-school vocational qualifications.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur)
LD
The next item of business is stage 3 proceedings on the Education (Scotland) Bill. In dealing with the amendments, members should have the bill as amended at...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
Group 1 is on support needs. Amendment 1, in the name of Miles Briggs, is grouped with amendments 5, 165 to 168, 321, 248, 249 and 76.
Miles Briggs (Lothian) (Con)
Con
In the interests of brevity, I will try to speed up my comments during the rest of the afternoon. I was pleased to lodge this suite of amendments following ...
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
First, let me say a huge thank you to the legislation team, who have been working day and night to support members across the chamber with the amendments tha...
The Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (Jenny Gilruth)
SNP
I thank Mr Briggs and Ms Duncan-Glancy for setting out their amendments. I put on the record my sincere thanks to Scottish Government officials in the legisl...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
I call Miles Briggs to wind up and say whether he wishes to press or withdraw amendment 1.
Miles Briggs
Con
I have nothing further to add, and I press the amendment. Amendment 1 agreed to. Section 4—The accreditation function
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
Group 2 is on accreditation and quality assurance of qualifications. Amendment 98, in the name of Pam Duncan-Glancy, is grouped with amendments 125, 147, 154...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I ask members to please be patient and consider what I say carefully as I outline a number of the amendments in this group, which may take a bit of time. Th...
Ross Greer (West Scotland) (Green)
Green
Will the member take an intervention?
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I am happy to take Ross Greer’s intervention.
Ross Greer
Green
Would the member join me in recognising the difference between accreditation and quality assurance? Simply moving the current accreditation function to any o...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
Mr Greer is quite right in relation to higher history, but he did not point out that, although the SQA does not accredit or regulate our school qualification...
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
We debated the issue at length at stage 2. I remind Pam Duncan-Glancy of correspondence that the committee and I received from Unite the Union, which represe...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I thank the cabinet secretary for that intervention, which I was prepared for. The cabinet secretary knows full well that the members of Unite in the Scottis...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
Did the cabinet secretary wish to make an intervention?
Jenny Gilruth
SNP
For the record, I was not laughing at the content of Ms Duncan-Glancy’s contribution.
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I thank the cabinet secretary for that clarification. I am pleased that she will listen to and take seriously what is being said. The Education, Children an...
The Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government (Shona Robison)
SNP
Did I mishear? I thought that I had just heard Pam Duncan-Glancy talk about making good law today. She and her party are voting against the bill, are they not?
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I thank the cabinet secretary—
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Will my colleague take an intervention?
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I will.
Martin Whitfield
Lab
I am very grateful—Interruption. I suggest that my colleague has articulated clearly the reason for her conclusion in the summation of her contribution. Had—
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
Resume your seat, Mr Whitfield. This will be a long afternoon and evening. It will be even longer if we do not listen to the member who has the floor, who, ...
Martin Whitfield
Lab
I am very grateful, Deputy Presiding Officer. I shudder at your premonition of how today might go. Had members listened to my colleague’s submission, they w...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I thank the member for that intervention—I enjoy the unity that we have across Scottish Labour, which is not something that we always see across the Governme...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
Before calling the next speaker, I want members to reflect on the fact that discussions took place with business managers and members with key amendments abo...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD)
LD
I fully respect Pam Duncan-Glancy, but I must disagree with her this afternoon. The fact that she has presented a number of options shows that there is still...
Pam Duncan-Glancy
Lab
I hugely respect the member and it pains me to have to disagree with his direction of travel here. The reason why there are options is not that we have not c...
Willie Rennie
LD
The process has been constructive. It is a good example of how committees can work well together. We have come to an issue that is not central to the reform...