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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 18 June 2025

18 Jun 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Defence Sector (Economic Contribution)
MacDonald, Gordon SNP Edinburgh Pentlands Watch on SPTV

Scotland’s defence sector, which covers aerospace, defence and security, is valued at £3.2 billion and directly supports more than 33,000 jobs. I acknowledge the sector’s importance, although I believe that it should, over time, diversify towards commercial activities, ensuring that Scotland remains a hub for manufacturing and innovation. However, what I cannot accept is that parts of Scotland’s defence industry are manufacturing components such as systems for the Paveway smart bombs that are used by the Israeli air force in Gaza.

A 2021 investigation by The Ferret website revealed that Scottish defence companies have supplied components for Israel’s F-16 and F-35 aircraft, rocket systems and engines for G550 surveillance aircraft, all of which are likely to have been deployed over Gaza. Over the past decade, the UK Government has licensed hundreds of millions of pounds in arms exports to Israel, including bombs, drones, grenades, small arms, tanks and missiles.

Despite public pressure, the UK Labour Government has suspended fewer than 10 per cent of arms export licences to Israel. I urge the UK Government to halt all defence-related export licences to Israel until the killing of Palestinians stops.

What is happening in Palestine reminds me of how, from 1974 to 1978, the workers at the Rolls-Royce factory in East Kilbride refused to work on Chilean air force plane parts because of the atrocities that were being committed by the Pinochet dictatorship. That boycott—a powerful act of solidarity with the people of Chile—grounded half of Chile’s air force, as the film “Nae Pasaran” documents. It is time that trade unions across the UK took a similar stance to those East Kilbride workers 50 years ago in order to stop the genocide that is being committed by Israel.

Defence is an important sector, but it is important to recognise the size of the industry, as it accounts for just over 2 per cent of Scotland’s economy, as measured by gross value added, and is worth 5 per cent of the UK’s £62 billion defence budget. Thankfully, Scotland’s economy is diverse and resilient, and non-defence sectors drive nearly 98 per cent of GVA. All key parts of Scotland’s economy—land use, energy, construction and non-defence manufacturing—are worth more than, or equal, the defence sector’s contribution.

As with most parts of the UK, Scotland’s economy depends on the service sector. Individual sectors—such as information and communications; finance and insurance; professional, scientific and technical research; tourism and hospitality; retail and wholesaling; real estate; health; and education—are worth more to the Scottish economy than the defence sector is when it comes to GVA. I welcome the support that the Scottish Government provides in order to encourage that continued diversity. I also welcome the fact that, since it was first elected, the Scottish Government has invested £45 million in companies that are involved in defence contracts.

The motion refers to a Scottish Enterprise grant that was not awarded to Rolls-Royce to support

“specialist naval welding”

training

“for submarine construction”.

However, it overlooks the fact that most expenditure and work on the nuclear submarines will occur in Barrow-in-Furness in north-west England. It also fails to note the Scottish Government’s £2 million investment in engineering skills in the Glasgow city region, which was developed by the Clyde maritime cluster in partnership with Skills Development Scotland. I question why Rolls-Royce Holdings, which has a turnover of £18.9 billion and £2.5 billion in net profit, requires public funding of £2.5 million for a skills centre to fulfil its contracts.

16:37  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-17981, in the name of Murdo Fraser, on recognising the economic contribution of Scotland’s defence sector...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
We are continually being invited by the Deputy First Minister to be positive about the Scottish economy and to celebrate success stories—indeed, we just hear...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Murdo Fraser is absolutely right. Does that situation not also stand in contrast with the attacks on our communications infrastructure in the North Sea, and ...
Murdo Fraser Con
Yes. I welcome the fact that the UK Government has stepped in, because those jobs and that investment would have gone elsewhere. Steve Carlier, president of ...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Gaelic (Kate Forbes) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to speak to the motion. I will try to cover quite a lot of ground in a limited time, but I will begin by stating plainly that Scotl...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Kate Forbes SNP
Members will appreciate that I think that my time has just been cut again and I want to cover quite a lot of space.
Jackie Baillie Lab
On a point of order, Deputy Presiding Officer, could you give an indication of whether the cabinet secretary’s time has been cut again?
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I can confirm that the cabinet secretary’s time has not been cut, but it is still up to five minutes. I can give you the time back for that point of order, D...
Kate Forbes SNP
My apologies to Jackie Baillie. I had been anticipating slightly longer, so I am going to try to compress my comments; unfortunately, I now have even less ti...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the statement that the Deputy First Minister made at the beginning of her speech underlining the importance of the defence sector. It is not the fi...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
Will the member take an intervention?
Daniel Johnson Lab
I am very happy to do so, but it will need to be brief.
Edward Mountain Con
I will keep it very brief. I will quote Patrick Harvie, which I do not do often: “Scotland has strong solidarity with Ukraine and is outraged at those who w...
Daniel Johnson Lab
I think that we are not taking our own defence seriously by not considering what we need to do in terms of restocking our munitions. My point is highlighted ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
You need to conclude—
Daniel Johnson Lab
—we need to invest in it. I move amendment S6M-17981.1, to insert at end: “; welcomes the confirmation from the UK Government that it will provide the fund...
Lorna Slater (Lothian) (Green) Green
As per our position in the previous debate, the Scottish Greens believe in progressive taxation as a way to pool our collective resources and invest in the t...
Jackson Carlaw (Eastwood) (Con) Con
Will Lorna Slater take an intervention?
Lorna Slater Green
I will take interventions during my closing speech. The Scottish Government offered to review Scottish Enterprise’s human rights checks. While that has been...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I get slightly offended when people imply that we cannot be in favour of strong defences and in favour of a moral and ethical foreign policy. I think that we...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
We move to the open debate. 16:28
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
When the SNP is up to its neck in muck and bullets—although that might not be an appropriate term, given its attitude towards bullets—it sends for Kate Forbe...
Daniel Johnson Lab
Does the member agree that the view that we should seek to defend our country should be a patriotic view, regardless of our view on the constitution? Our vie...
Stephen Kerr Con
I could not agree more with Daniel Johnson. It is about a patriotic duty. It might not be fashionable in the SNP, or in the Scottish Greens, to talk about pa...
Gordon MacDonald (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) SNP
Scotland’s defence sector, which covers aerospace, defence and security, is valued at £3.2 billion and directly supports more than 33,000 jobs. I acknowledge...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I am delighted to stand up and speak in the debate, even if it is to highlight some of the incredible things that I hear other parties saying. First, I put o...
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
It is a pleasure to speak in the debate, and I second the amendment in the name of my colleague Mr Johnson. It is a very sensible amendment and I encourage t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
You need to conclude.
Paul Sweeney Lab
That is fairly axiomatic.