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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 18 June 2025

18 Jun 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Defence Sector (Economic Contribution)
Forbes, Kate SNP Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch Watch on SPTV

My apologies to Jackie Baillie. I had been anticipating slightly longer, so I am going to try to compress my comments; unfortunately, I now have even less time to do so.

We are targeting Scotland’s public support towards innovation, training and economic diversification. For example, we have helped Leonardo to develop civilian radar and sensing technologies, we have supported Raytheon in expanding into commercial aerospace and we have backed Walker Precision Engineering in its aerospace and medical technologies.

We are not only investing in businesses but in people, especially our young people. Scotland’s defence sector, like many others, depends on a skilled workforce, which is why the Government continues to make significant investments in science, technology, engineering and maths education and training. Last year alone, we invested more than £1.74 million in programmes that support the delivery of high-quality STEM learning in schools. We are supporting the future workforce through apprenticeships by backing around 25,500 new modern apprenticeships in 2025-26 and continuing to support more than 38,000 apprentices who are already in training, many of whom are in STEM fields that are critical to Scotland’s industrial future, including defence.

More than 80 per cent of apprentices in STEM start their training at higher levels, ensuring that we develop the advanced skills needed in high-tech sectors, including those that support aerospace, marine engineering and advanced manufacturing. We fund the young STEM leader programme, which has engaged more than 20,000 young people across every local authority in Scotland, and the STEM nation award programme, which has supported more than 8,800 teachers and almost 120,000 pupils in recognising and building excellence in STEM teaching.

We are embedding STEM in the heart of our education system and supporting our current economic sectors. That is future proofing our economy for decades to come. We are investing up to £2 million to develop engineering skills in the Glasgow city region in a programme designed by the Clyde maritime cluster in partnership with Skills Development Scotland, of which a key player is BAE Systems.

Just as we invest in the skills and technologies of the future, we must also ensure that our investment decisions reflect the kind of future that we want to build—one that is grounded in integrity and respect for human rights. That is why the Government signed up to the United Nations guiding principles on business and human rights and it is why our enterprise agencies operate a robust due diligence process to assess companies’ human rights records before funding is approved.

That is why we voted for the Labour amendment that committed Scottish Enterprise to reviewing its human rights due diligence checks, and we plan to update Parliament on that before recess.

Defence is a reserved matter under the Scotland Act 1998. Where UK Government funding is provided directly for munitions manufacturing, that is its prerogative. It is a matter that the Opposition is quick to remind us of in relation to how we spend our budget. Our approach recognises that defence is hugely important. Scotland will continue to play a key role in supporting our allies, including Ukraine. Our support will focus on creating high-skilled, sustainable jobs and supporting innovation across the defence sector.

The defence sector is vital to our economy, and it will remain so. We will continue to invest in defence-related innovation, skills and infrastructure to build a defence economy that is fit for the future, productive and proud.

I move amendment S6M-17981.3, to leave out from “; notes” to end and insert:

“, and in protecting national security, especially at a time of increased global instability, and notes that defence is a matter reserved to the UK Government under the Scotland Act 1998 and that the Scottish Government’s long-standing position is that public money should focus on diversification.”

16:15  
References in this contribution

Motions, questions or amendments mentioned by their reference code.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-17981, in the name of Murdo Fraser, on recognising the economic contribution of Scotland’s defence sector...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
We are continually being invited by the Deputy First Minister to be positive about the Scottish economy and to celebrate success stories—indeed, we just hear...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Murdo Fraser is absolutely right. Does that situation not also stand in contrast with the attacks on our communications infrastructure in the North Sea, and ...
Murdo Fraser Con
Yes. I welcome the fact that the UK Government has stepped in, because those jobs and that investment would have gone elsewhere. Steve Carlier, president of ...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Gaelic (Kate Forbes) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to speak to the motion. I will try to cover quite a lot of ground in a limited time, but I will begin by stating plainly that Scotl...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Kate Forbes SNP
Members will appreciate that I think that my time has just been cut again and I want to cover quite a lot of space.
Jackie Baillie Lab
On a point of order, Deputy Presiding Officer, could you give an indication of whether the cabinet secretary’s time has been cut again?
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I can confirm that the cabinet secretary’s time has not been cut, but it is still up to five minutes. I can give you the time back for that point of order, D...
Kate Forbes SNP
My apologies to Jackie Baillie. I had been anticipating slightly longer, so I am going to try to compress my comments; unfortunately, I now have even less ti...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the statement that the Deputy First Minister made at the beginning of her speech underlining the importance of the defence sector. It is not the fi...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
Will the member take an intervention?
Daniel Johnson Lab
I am very happy to do so, but it will need to be brief.
Edward Mountain Con
I will keep it very brief. I will quote Patrick Harvie, which I do not do often: “Scotland has strong solidarity with Ukraine and is outraged at those who w...
Daniel Johnson Lab
I think that we are not taking our own defence seriously by not considering what we need to do in terms of restocking our munitions. My point is highlighted ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
You need to conclude—
Daniel Johnson Lab
—we need to invest in it. I move amendment S6M-17981.1, to insert at end: “; welcomes the confirmation from the UK Government that it will provide the fund...
Lorna Slater (Lothian) (Green) Green
As per our position in the previous debate, the Scottish Greens believe in progressive taxation as a way to pool our collective resources and invest in the t...
Jackson Carlaw (Eastwood) (Con) Con
Will Lorna Slater take an intervention?
Lorna Slater Green
I will take interventions during my closing speech. The Scottish Government offered to review Scottish Enterprise’s human rights checks. While that has been...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I get slightly offended when people imply that we cannot be in favour of strong defences and in favour of a moral and ethical foreign policy. I think that we...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
We move to the open debate. 16:28
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
When the SNP is up to its neck in muck and bullets—although that might not be an appropriate term, given its attitude towards bullets—it sends for Kate Forbe...
Daniel Johnson Lab
Does the member agree that the view that we should seek to defend our country should be a patriotic view, regardless of our view on the constitution? Our vie...
Stephen Kerr Con
I could not agree more with Daniel Johnson. It is about a patriotic duty. It might not be fashionable in the SNP, or in the Scottish Greens, to talk about pa...
Gordon MacDonald (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) SNP
Scotland’s defence sector, which covers aerospace, defence and security, is valued at £3.2 billion and directly supports more than 33,000 jobs. I acknowledge...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I am delighted to stand up and speak in the debate, even if it is to highlight some of the incredible things that I hear other parties saying. First, I put o...
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
It is a pleasure to speak in the debate, and I second the amendment in the name of my colleague Mr Johnson. It is a very sensible amendment and I encourage t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
You need to conclude.
Paul Sweeney Lab
That is fairly axiomatic.