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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 18 June 2025

18 Jun 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Defence Sector (Economic Contribution)
Fraser, Murdo Con Mid Scotland and Fife Watch on SPTV

We are continually being invited by the Deputy First Minister to be positive about the Scottish economy and to celebrate success stories—indeed, we just heard that from her colleague, the finance secretary. I regard it as one of my purposes in life to try to make the Deputy First Minister happy. [Laughter.] That is why, this afternoon, we are going to do just as she wants and talk about the success and strength of the Scottish economy and, in particular, our vital defence sector. I hope that she and her Scottish National Party colleagues will be as enthusiastic as we are about that vital industry for Scotland.

Scotland’s defence sector provides a considerable contribution to our economy. As of 2023-24, the United Kingdom Ministry of Defence spends almost £2.1 billion per year in Scotland—that is more per head of population in Scotland than in the rest of the UK.

We not only make military equipment for the UK here in Scotland; we export, very successfully. The total contribution of the aerospace defence and security industry to Scotland was estimated at £3.2 billion in 2022. That sector employs 35,000 people, including 1,500 apprentices.

Right across Scotland, we see companies providing high-quality, well paid jobs in the science, technology, engineering and mathematics sector. BAE Systems is building frigates on the Clyde for the Royal Navy and directly employing 2,700 people. At Rosyth and Faslane, Babcock is supporting more than 3,000 jobs.

Is it not something of an irony that we can have world-leading shipbuilding on the Clyde and at Rosyth, building ships for the Royal Navy, but the SNP Government cannot even supply two ferries from its nationalised shipyard at Port Glasgow?

We have Leonardo, known for many years to people in Edinburgh as Ferranti, building world-leading avionics and supplying radar systems for Lockheed Martin, among others. We have Thales, employing almost 800 people across two sites in Glasgow and Rosyth. In Glenrothes, which is in my region, we have Raytheon building the javelin anti-tank missiles, which are being deployed so effectively right now by our brave Ukrainian allies, taking out the Russian tanks that are illegally invading their country. We should be proud of that.

We should celebrate those successes, but we should also recognise the opportunities for the future. Every western Government that is faced with the situation in Ukraine, instability in the middle east and an increasingly isolationist US Administration is devoting more resources to military spending. In last week’s spending review, the Chancellor of the Exchequer promised that defence spending would rise from 2.3 per cent to 2.6 per cent of gross domestic product by 2027. If delivered, that will equate to an £11 billion uplift in spending, providing real opportunities for Scotland, not least in the upgrading of the nuclear submarine fleet at Faslane.

There are massive opportunities to grow our exports to nations across the world that are similarly increasing their defence spending, to earn more wealth for this country and create more jobs. Against that backdrop, we might expect the Scottish Government, which claims that it stands up for Scotland, to look to support the industry, seize those opportunities in full and create more jobs and apprenticeships. Instead, we see negativity and downright hostility.

One of the sector leaders, Rolls-Royce, planned to establish a specialist submarine welding facility on the Clyde—an £11 million investment to deliver a world-leading facility to support the construction and maintenance of the submarine fleet. That project had been in development for years and would have reduced costs, cut carbon emissions and created high-value jobs—just the sort of project that we should welcome and support. The project depended on a critical £2.5 million grant from Scottish Enterprise. However, the SNP decided that that grant could not be given, because of its policy of not funding “munitions”. Shame on it, Presiding Officer.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-17981, in the name of Murdo Fraser, on recognising the economic contribution of Scotland’s defence sector...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
We are continually being invited by the Deputy First Minister to be positive about the Scottish economy and to celebrate success stories—indeed, we just hear...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Murdo Fraser is absolutely right. Does that situation not also stand in contrast with the attacks on our communications infrastructure in the North Sea, and ...
Murdo Fraser Con
Yes. I welcome the fact that the UK Government has stepped in, because those jobs and that investment would have gone elsewhere. Steve Carlier, president of ...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Economy and Gaelic (Kate Forbes) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to speak to the motion. I will try to cover quite a lot of ground in a limited time, but I will begin by stating plainly that Scotl...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Kate Forbes SNP
Members will appreciate that I think that my time has just been cut again and I want to cover quite a lot of space.
Jackie Baillie Lab
On a point of order, Deputy Presiding Officer, could you give an indication of whether the cabinet secretary’s time has been cut again?
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I can confirm that the cabinet secretary’s time has not been cut, but it is still up to five minutes. I can give you the time back for that point of order, D...
Kate Forbes SNP
My apologies to Jackie Baillie. I had been anticipating slightly longer, so I am going to try to compress my comments; unfortunately, I now have even less ti...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the statement that the Deputy First Minister made at the beginning of her speech underlining the importance of the defence sector. It is not the fi...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
Will the member take an intervention?
Daniel Johnson Lab
I am very happy to do so, but it will need to be brief.
Edward Mountain Con
I will keep it very brief. I will quote Patrick Harvie, which I do not do often: “Scotland has strong solidarity with Ukraine and is outraged at those who w...
Daniel Johnson Lab
I think that we are not taking our own defence seriously by not considering what we need to do in terms of restocking our munitions. My point is highlighted ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
You need to conclude—
Daniel Johnson Lab
—we need to invest in it. I move amendment S6M-17981.1, to insert at end: “; welcomes the confirmation from the UK Government that it will provide the fund...
Lorna Slater (Lothian) (Green) Green
As per our position in the previous debate, the Scottish Greens believe in progressive taxation as a way to pool our collective resources and invest in the t...
Jackson Carlaw (Eastwood) (Con) Con
Will Lorna Slater take an intervention?
Lorna Slater Green
I will take interventions during my closing speech. The Scottish Government offered to review Scottish Enterprise’s human rights checks. While that has been...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I get slightly offended when people imply that we cannot be in favour of strong defences and in favour of a moral and ethical foreign policy. I think that we...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
We move to the open debate. 16:28
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
When the SNP is up to its neck in muck and bullets—although that might not be an appropriate term, given its attitude towards bullets—it sends for Kate Forbe...
Daniel Johnson Lab
Does the member agree that the view that we should seek to defend our country should be a patriotic view, regardless of our view on the constitution? Our vie...
Stephen Kerr Con
I could not agree more with Daniel Johnson. It is about a patriotic duty. It might not be fashionable in the SNP, or in the Scottish Greens, to talk about pa...
Gordon MacDonald (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) SNP
Scotland’s defence sector, which covers aerospace, defence and security, is valued at £3.2 billion and directly supports more than 33,000 jobs. I acknowledge...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I am delighted to stand up and speak in the debate, even if it is to highlight some of the incredible things that I hear other parties saying. First, I put o...
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
It is a pleasure to speak in the debate, and I second the amendment in the name of my colleague Mr Johnson. It is a very sensible amendment and I encourage t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
You need to conclude.
Paul Sweeney Lab
That is fairly axiomatic.