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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 18 February 2025

18 Feb 2025 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Business Motion
White, Tess Con North East Scotland Watch on SPTV

I thank Jackie Baillie, and I completely agree with her that the Scottish Government and its agencies are not above the law.

The situation that has arisen in NHS Fife speaks volumes about what is happening behind closed doors in Scotland’s public sector under the SNP Government. The reality is that Nicola Sturgeon’s self-identification policy has binned the rights of biologically female employees to access single-sex spaces. Taxpayers’ money is being used to cover legal costs to defend a public body’s gender policy, but there is no transparency over the cost to the public purse because the health board involved will not disclose that information. That is simply not acceptable, especially when the health service is in crisis and budgets are being squeezed.

It has been reported that the Cabinet Secretary for Health and Social Care, Neil Gray, was made aware in June last year of the situation in NHS Fife and the legal implications of it. We need clarity over Neil Gray’s involvement or lack thereof.

The public interest in the issue is huge. It has been covered extensively in the press and MSPs have been contacted by constituents with legitimate questions and concerns, and yet we have not been able to bring those questions to the chamber. Topical questions, First Minister’s questions and urgent questions that have been lodged on the issue have not been selected. Meanwhile, our colleagues in Westminster have been able to raise it. It is deeply disappointing that, once again, this Parliament cannot discharge its duties to the public because members do not have parliamentary privilege.

Women are watching today. The public has had enough of the recent abdication, obfuscation and moral cowardice from the Government, and we are only going to see more witch hunts at the public’s expense if we do not get clarity on the Scottish Government’s position. I urge members to support my amendment.

I move amendment S6M-16518.1, to leave out first “5.15 pm Decision Time” and insert:

followed by Ministerial Statement: Public Sector Workers’ Access to Single Sex Spaces

5.45 pm Decision Time”.

References in this contribution

Motions, questions or amendments mentioned by their reference code.

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Alison Johnstone) NPA
The next item of business is consideration of business motion S6M-16518, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau, on changes to t...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I call Tess White to speak to and move amendment S6M-16518.1. You have up to five minutes, Ms White. 14:04
Tess White (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
Sandie Peggie, who has been a national health service nurse for 30 years, spoke up for her sex-based rights in her workplace because she did not want to shar...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
The protection of single-sex spaces based on biological sex is a matter of law—it is in the Equality Act 2010. In supporting the amendment calling for a stat...
Tess White Con
I thank Jackie Baillie, and I completely agree with her that the Scottish Government and its agencies are not above the law. The situation that has arisen i...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I call Jamie Hepburn to respond on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau. 14:07
The Minister for Parliamentary Business (Jamie Hepburn) SNP
I will set out why we cannot accept the request for a statement and cannot agree to the amendment in Tess White’s name. First, she has clearly indicated that...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I entirely understand the Government’s reluctance to comment on a live criminal case—particularly a criminal case that involves a jury, which might be swayed...
Jamie Hepburn SNP
There speaks the voice of inexperience—sub judice relates not just to criminal cases but to civil cases. That is an absolute nonsense from Mr Fraser. It is a...
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
Will the minister give way on that point?
Jamie Hepburn SNP
I am afraid that I will not give way to Mr Kerr. We hear from him all too frequently, so we will not hear from him on this occasion. The last point, which i...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I remind all members of the need to treat one another with courtesy and respect. The question is, that amendment S6M-16518.1, in the name of Tess White, whi...
The Presiding Officer NPA
There will be a division. There will be a short suspension to allow members to access the digital voting system. 14:13 Meeting suspended. 14:19 On resuming—
The Presiding Officer NPA
We come to the vote on amendment S6M-16518.1, in the name of Tess White, which seeks to amend motion S6M-16518, in the name of Jamie Hepburn, on behalf of th...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) SNP
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I had a technical issue. I would have voted no.
The Presiding Officer NPA
Thank you, Ms Grahame. We will ensure that that is recorded.
Foysol Choudhury (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. I had the same issue. I would have voted yes.
The Presiding Officer NPA
Thank you, Mr Choudhury. We will ensure that that is recorded. For Baillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Balfour,...
The Presiding Officer NPA
The result of the division on amendment S6M-16518.1, in the name of Tess White, is: For 47, Against 64, Abstentions 0. Amendment disagreed to.
Douglas Ross (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. Parliament has just decided—we assume with the votes of Scottish National Party and Green members—not to allow a stat...
The Presiding Officer NPA
Let us hear Mr Ross. Do continue.
Douglas Ross Con
SNP members seem to think that this is funny. I think that it is serious that Parliament should be able to address an issue that is both topical and urgent. ...
The Presiding Officer NPA
In line with long-standing convention and in common with my predecessors, I do not give reasons for selection decisions. I consider each question that is lod...
Douglas Ross Con
When?
The Presiding Officer NPA
Mr Ross! I ask you to stop speaking from your seat in that manner. You are an experienced member of this Parliament, and I am sure that you are wholly aware ...
Douglas Ross Con
On that, I have a point of order.
The Presiding Officer NPA
Further to that point of order, Mr Ross, I have nothing else to add, so please do not repeat what you have said previously.
Douglas Ross Con
Further to my previous point of order, Presiding Officer, you said that you offered members opportunities throughout the week to raise those questions. Could...
The Presiding Officer NPA
Mr Ross, I have explained the situation quite clearly. I am not sitting here and explaining matters that you understand wholly and thoroughly. You are very w...
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
On a point of order, Presiding Officer. In connection with rules 13.3, 13.4, 13.6B and 5.4 of standing orders, I ask for your guidance on a significant matte...