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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 12 November 2024

12 Nov 2024 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Women’s Health Plan 2021 to 2024
Roddick, Emma SNP Highlands and Islands Watch on SPTV

I was glad to hear, in the minister’s opening speech, about the progress that has been made on endometriosis and, in particular, on managing the pain that comes with the condition. Alex Cole-Hamilton also made some good points about the need for cultural change.

There have been changes since the appointment of a women’s health champion. I have felt that change as a member of the Parliament and as someone who keenly listened to debate and discussion in this place on women’s health issues before I was elected. I can see that there is progress in the platform that these issues have and in the willingness of a wide group—not just the usual suspects who champion these issues regularly—to accept that there are problems and to enter conversations about how to solve them. That bodes well for the overall aim of using the fact that Scotland has this role to precipitate wider societal and cultural change. It is always welcome to see real leadership being taken across the parties, which can translate to changing minds and cultures outside.

I credit the minister with the impact that her approach has had. I have also enjoyed regular engagement with Opposition colleagues, as well as with the minister, on a wide range of issues related to women’s health. She has been open, understanding and willing to take on board expertise and knowledge that exists across the chamber. That is certainly contributing to reaching the cross-party consensus on women’s health that Engender and other members who have spoken in the debate have called for.

I will speak about a few issues that will not be new to the minister, as we have had conversations about them already. Mental health remains a significant women’s health issue. It is difficult to see in statistics the different experience that women with mental health issues face compared with those of others who access different services. Being a woman impacts the diagnosis that we will get if we have mental health issues. That is borne out in the statistics around mental health and cardiovascular and chronic pain conditions, which show that women and men often present with the same symptoms but are frequently given different diagnoses.

Being a woman impacts how other conditions will be treated if a person has a mental health issue, chronic pain or fatigue. I bet that every MSP has had a constituent raise evidence supporting that at some stage during the past three years. Being a woman also impacts on the treatment that we receive. There are times when that is justifiable, because our needs may be different, but it is not acceptable that my constituents still feel that they are being brushed aside or that their symptoms are minimised because they are female.

Many chronic conditions often go hand in hand with mental health issues. Living with chronic pain will affect someone’s mood, often clinically, and mental health issues are frequently diagnosed in people with the likes of endometriosis, myalgic encephalitis, multiple sclerosis and other chronic conditions. We have to get better at drawing a distinction between clinical mental illness and reasonable reactions to difficult situations. Almost every patient with a chronic illness and depression to whom I have spoken has said that, at some point, they have been told something along the lines of, “Of course you’re sad—anybody would be.”

People with depression understand the difference between feeling sad and having depression, which are completely different in terms of quality of life, hopelessness and the impact on the ability to function. A few weeks ago, one member of Glasgow Disability Alliance told colleagues in Parliament that they had been told, “I would kill myself if I had your life.” That is the type of stigma and dismissal that people face. It is a lot harder for someone to get help for mental health issues if the people who are assessing them think that they should be feeling depressed.

Given those cross-cutting issues, which touch on both women’s health and mental health, work on the approach to either aspect needs to be done with awareness of the other. North Highland Women’s Wellbeing Hub has done incredible work in sharing resources on many issues affecting women. I am sure that the minister is aware of that work, given that her colleague Maree Todd, as the Minister for Social Care, Mental Wellbeing and Sport, and I both represent the area that the group covers.

At a meeting that I had with North Highland Women’s Wellbeing Hub earlier this year, Kirsteen showed me the leaflets and resources that the group has made up to support women who have been diagnosed with various conditions. It is a shame that it actually felt quite wondrous to see information on endometriosis, menopause and postural tachycardia syndrome laid out clearly and to imagine people, in the moment that they are diagnosed, receiving such helpful and clear information. It is a massive step forward, and I hope that the Government will look at the take-up of post-diagnosis support in NHS Highland that has come from the North Highland Women’s Wellbeing Hub and consider how that type of information can best be made available and standardised.

It is also fantastic to hear about the impact that having an islander in post has had in the taking of sensible approaches. Accepting that we have to do things differently in different places does not mean that the end result has to be difference. The buddy system that exists to ensure that island health providers can still access quality information is a great way to ensure that, no matter where people are, they can access specialist advice.

Before concluding, I will touch on abortion care, which cuts across everything else that I have spoken about. Pregnancy is more dangerous to some than to others. Mental and physical health conditions, when they are combined with pregnancy, can be life threatening, so it is critical that we continue to strongly and frequently defend the right of Scots to access abortions in the face of attacks on those rights around the world. Nothing that we have won is guaranteed, and we must continue to recognise the necessity of quality and accessible abortion care.

I am proud of the steps that the Parliament has taken to protect people who are accessing abortion services through the Abortion Services (Safe Access Zones) (Scotland) Act 2024, which brought in safe access zones. However, there is work to be done to ensure that there are services available to access for everyone, including—for those who need it—up to 24 weeks, which is currently the limit in Scotland in law but not in practice. No matter where people live, they should not be forced to carry a pregnancy that they do not want to go through with, and I look forward to hearing updates on work that is to be carried out to ensure that that is the reality.

I also look forward to seeing what comes of the next iteration of the plan overall. I am hopeful. It can often feel difficult to feel hopeful about the topic of women’s health, so I thank all those with lived experience, who have rightly been at the centre of the work on the plan and of the Government’s motion, and colleagues on all sides of the chamber, including the minister, who have put in the work on the plan.

15:48  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-15382, in the name of Jenni Minto, on progress and next steps on the women’s health plan 2021 to 2024. 1...
The Minister for Public Health and Women’s Health (Jenni Minto) SNP
I am extremely passionate about women’s health, so I warmly welcome this debate and the opportunity to bring this important topic back to the chamber. We kn...
Rachael Hamilton (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Con
The minister met me and endometriosis campaigners last April. She looked at a policy paper from the Scottish Conservatives regarding ways to improve access t...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I will give you the time back, minister.
Jenni Minto SNP
I thank Rachael Hamilton for her work, specifically in the Borders, on endometriosis diagnosis times. I recognise that diagnosis times for endometriosis are ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
It is clear to say that, when it comes to specialist neonatal services, the consultants, all the clinicians and the women who are involved are opposed to the...
Jenni Minto SNP
We have received advice from clinical experts in the field, and they, as well as the charity Bliss, which advocates for parents, all support the reduction in...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I invite Annie Wells to speak to and move amendment S6M-15382.1. 15:09
Annie Wells (Glasgow) (Con) Con
I begin by thanking the many organisations that have provided briefings for the debate. Health is one of the biggest issues in the minds of people across our...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I call Carol Mochan to speak to and move amendment S6M-15382.2. 15:17
Carol Mochan (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am so pleased that Government time has been given to debating women’s health today. We will support the Government’s motion tonight. If we have learned an...
Tess White (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
Does Carol Mochan agree that there needs to be a separate road map for women and that the women’s health plan needs to be sex specific?
Carol Mochan Lab
Yes, of course. I return to my point about unhealthy life expectancy. Not only do our poorest neighbours die younger, they live life in a much poorer state ...
Gillian Mackay (Central Scotland) (Green) Green
The women’s health plan that was launched in 2021 marked a significant commitment to addressing the distinct health needs of women across Scotland and aimed ...
Tess White Con
I would like to ask you whether you—
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
Through the chair, please, Ms White.
Tess White Con
Sorry. Does the member agree that we benefited from working collaboratively in the work that we did as a committee on the buffer zones?
Gillian Mackay Green
Absolutely. It very much helps us all if we work collaboratively in the sphere of women’s health. I hope that we will have a similar level of conversation in...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
It gives me pleasure to speak for the Liberal Democrats in what is a vital debate. I am grateful to Jenny Minto for securing Government time to bring the deb...
Tess White Con
Alex Cole-Hamilton referenced the US in relation to abortion, but will he also applaud the fact that, even though Donald Trump is a controversial figure, he ...
Alex Cole-Hamilton LD
I very much regret that Tess White wants to lower the tone of what has so far been a consensual debate. That problem stems from her, and I ask her to reflect...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
I note that a member who was looking to participate in the debate has not been here throughout the opening speeches, for which I will need an explanation and...
Emma Roddick (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) SNP
I was glad to hear, in the minister’s opening speech, about the progress that has been made on endometriosis and, in particular, on managing the pain that co...
Tess White (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
As the first women’s health plan comes to an end, I welcome the opportunity to take stock. I thank Jenni Minto and her team for the cross-party working that ...
Kenneth Gibson (Cunninghame North) (SNP) SNP
Over the years, I have raised concerns about a range of women’s health issues, from endometriosis and pre-eclampsia to cardiovascular conditions and breast c...
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I thank the Government for bringing forward this debate on such an important issue. Although I welcome the fact that some progress has been made on the women...
Clare Adamson (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) SNP
I am pleased to contribute to what has been an informative and excellent debate. I will begin by following on from Pam Duncan-Glancy’s thoughtful contributio...
Audrey Nicoll (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) SNP
Like my colleagues, I am pleased that we are taking time to debate the subject of women’s health. It is an issue that regularly appears in my constituency po...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
We now move to closing speeches. I call Gillian Mackay to close on behalf of the Scottish Greens. 16:21
Gillian Mackay Green
This has been an interesting debate and I will reflect on some of the contributions. In her opening statement, the minister laid out how important it is to l...