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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 06 November 2024

06 Nov 2024 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Keeping the Promise
Mackay, Gillian Green Central Scotland Watch on SPTV

I, too, thank the minister for holding this hugely important debate. Like others, I reaffirm the Scottish Greens’ commitment to achieving the Promise.

I do not think that anyone could argue with what the Promise is at its heart. The recognition that important structural and societal barriers remain for care-experienced people reminds us of the urgency with which such barriers should be dismantled. What we have done so far and how we have pushed progress forward are really important. If the importance of an issue could be measured purely by the number of briefings and emails that we receive on it, this issue would be a high priority for the chamber.

With regard to steps forward, The Promise Scotland, in its briefing ahead of the debate, highlighted the Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Act 2024. My colleague Ross Greer managed to secure amendments to that legislation that sought to improve the way in which secure transport is delivered and scrutinised, because the transport provision for young people in secure care had been a bit of a missing link in the gradual raising of standards, quality and accountability over recent years.

The hope instead of handcuffs campaign raised the profile of the issue, too, highlighting that children in Scotland were being inappropriately restrained when in the care of secure transport providers, with handcuffs, for example, being used in situations in which they simply were not necessary. The use of restraint against children has, rightly, been the subject of significant scrutiny and debate in the Parliament and in council chambers across Scotland, and I am glad to note that progress has been made specifically in relation to schools, with greatly improved guidance being produced.

The availability of secure transport has also been an issue. The Education, Children and Young People Committee heard that, due to the lack of specialist providers in Scotland, transport providers were coming from hundreds of miles away to take young people relatively short distances. That was not good either for young people or for providers themselves. However, as the “Plan 24-30” document says:

“Keeping the promise will never not be urgent. Childhood is short, and precious. ”

That should focus minds on how we continue the pace of change and adapt current plans when issues arise.

Support for families and early intervention have been raised by several organisations. Helping families to thrive, and giving support and guidance before a crisis, are essential to keeping the Promise. The whole family wellbeing fund has been hailed as a positive step forward, but many families are still finding it difficult to navigate systems when they need help.

We must also remain aware of how budgets impact on the financing of third sector and other organisations that provide support and advocacy to families, as well as the effects on funds such as the whole family wellbeing fund. Projects under that fund cannot sustain many third sector organisations on their own. We know that financial positions are difficult, but often it is all too easy to cut funding for some of that vital work in order to plug gaps in statutory services. The reality is that many third sector organisations are either catching people who do not qualify for support, or preventing people in need from accessing statutory services in the first place.

I have attended a few events with organisations such as Who Cares? Scotland at which I have spoken directly to young people who are care experienced and have heard from them what they need from us, and I have found kinship care and relationships with siblings being mentioned often. There is a perception that kinship care is often dismissed as it can be too difficult to establish, or that only immediate family were considered for it. The definition of “kinship care” in the Scottish Government’s guidance is actually pretty broad, but it seems that, in certain cases, it might not be being explored to its full extent. I was going to ask the minister for an update on work in that space, but I am grateful to her for outlining some of the measures that are under way. I am particularly interested in the guidance to the social work sector to support kinship care. If she has any further information, either now or at a later point, I will be hugely grateful to get that detail.

As Roz McCall mentioned, there has been some progress on keeping siblings together, but the briefing from The Promise Scotland once again raises the issue of the lack of contact with siblings for care-experienced people. It is an issue that I have heard repeatedly from children and young people right across the country, and it appears that we are not yet getting it quite right every time. There needs to be a consistency of approach for siblings who have individual plans and orders through the hearings system to ensure that the system that is supposed to support them is not putting in place competing orders with different contact requirements. Not taking wider circumstances and important people in the care-experienced young person’s life into account is not getting it right for that child or young person.

The language that we use around care experience can also carry stigma. In the process of preparing for the debate, I read about some work that Clackmannanshire Council has undertaken to make the language that it uses about care experience more accessible. That could be the language used in reports, or in meetings, and it would ensure that the young people being talked about know what it is that people are saying, so that they can have meaningful input into their care. That very much prompted me to go back through this speech to see whether I had lived up to those accessibility standards.

We are talking about the simple things—things that we know make a lot of what we do more accessible, such as not using jargon or too many abbreviations, and making sure that the child or young person understands what is being said before moving on to the next topic. That might sound patronising, but the entire document is about how those little things encourage children and young people to be equal partners in their own care, to be able to participate and to explain their own view and experience.

I know that I am rapidly running out of time, and there are several more things that I wanted to cover and which I hope to be able to address in closing. In the interests of time, though, I will leave it there for now.

15:35  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-15205, in the name of Natalie Don-Innes, on keeping the Promise. I invite members who wish to participate...
The Minister for Children, Young People and The Promise (Natalie Don-Innes) SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer, for the opportunity to bring the debate to the chamber. As minister for the Promise, I have seen progress, listened to heart-wa...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
The definition of “care experience” is becoming one of the most important elements, and it is right that that definition is developed with people with care e...
Natalie Don-Innes SNP
We are consulting on that matter, which will be considered in anticipation of the bill. In August 2023, I was very proud to introduce the Scottish recommend...
Roz McCall (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I thank the minister for bringing this important debate to the chamber. I welcome the opportunity to reaffirm the commitment of Scottish Conservative members...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am a proud member of the Children’s Parliament “unfearties”; I stand with children to make rights real in day-to-day life. Today, as part of that journey, ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
Thank you very much indeed, Mr Whitfield. I call Gillian Mackay, who joins us remotely. 15:19
Gillian Mackay (Central Scotland) (Green) Green
I, too, thank the minister for holding this hugely important debate. Like others, I reaffirm the Scottish Greens’ commitment to achieving the Promise. I d...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
Of course, we in the Liberal Democrats recommit ourselves to the Promise, which is why we will support the Government’s motion this afternoon. However, we wi...
The Deputy Presiding Officer LD
We move to the open debate. 15:32
Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) SNP
I am pleased to speak in the debate. Hard as it may be for folks in the chamber to recognise, I was first elected to Aberdeen City Council in May 1999—some 2...
Oliver Mundell (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Con
On reflection, I wonder whether I have been in the Parliament for too long, because I find debates such as this one quite hard. I do not want to sour the ton...
Natalie Don-Innes SNP
I do not think that anybody is arguing that we have kept the Promise; we are on a journey to keep the Promise by 2030. I welcome hearing about the challenges...
Oliver Mundell Con
If the minister was listening, she would have heard that I did say that there are some things that we can be pleased with. However, although I do not want to...
Clare Haughey (Rutherglen) (SNP) SNP
It is easy to forget what a powerful statement it was when the Promise was launched and voices across the Parliament and our public services used the word “l...
Katy Clark (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the news that the much-needed Promise bill will be introduced during this session of Parliament. That will be a relief to care-experienced campaign...
Rona Mackay (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) SNP
Children and young people across Scotland deserve the very best that there is to offer in all aspects of their lives. It is our job as members of Parliament ...
Foysol Choudhury (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
Four years have passed since the introduction of the Promise. Although I was not a member of the Scottish Parliament then, I was pleased to see parties unite...
Nicola Sturgeon (Glasgow Southside) (SNP) SNP
Few, if any, issues matter more to me than this one. I know that that is true for the minister, too, and I commend her for her leadership on this mission. T...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
We move to the closing speeches. I call Gillian Mackay to close on behalf of the Scottish Greens. Ms Mackay joins us remotely. 16:16
Gillian Mackay Green
It has been a good debate—it has been a challenging debate for us all, but it has certainly been a good one. I absolutely agree with the minister that we ne...
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I am pleased to close today’s debate on the Promise on behalf of the Scottish Labour Party. We have heard from colleagues today, including the minister, Rona...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Thank you, Ms Duncan-Glancy. Miles Briggs will close on behalf of the Scottish Conservatives. 16:28
Miles Briggs (Lothian) (Con) Con
I thank the organisations that have provided helpful briefings for us ahead of the debate and I welcome to the public gallery representatives from them. As t...
Natalie Don-Innes SNP
I thank all members for their considered contributions throughout the debate. I am encouraged to hear that cross-party support to keep the Promise remains st...
Kevin Stewart SNP
How are we going to spread good practice across Scotland? Quite often, we hear about amazing things going on in one place but find that, in the next-door loc...
Natalie Don-Innes SNP
“Plan 24-30” is a good example of how that can be done. The more that develops and the more good practice is shared in that regard, the more we will be able ...
The Presiding Officer (Alison Johnstone) NPA
That concludes the debate on keeping the Promise.