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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 08 May 2024

08 May 2024 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Gender Identity Services for Children and Young People (Cass Review)

I draw members’ attention to my registered interest as a practising NHS general practitioner.

The Cass review was commissioned by NHS England four years ago, with the Scottish Government getting updates from 2022. It is an authoritative body of work. Researchers met an extensive range of stakeholders, including professionals, their respected governing organisations and people with lived experience, both directly and through the support of advocacy groups.

The Cass review made 32 recommendations. It concluded that children are being let down by a lack of research and by weak evidence on medical interventions in gender care. In the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee yesterday, Dr Cass set the record straight on the claims of critics of the review, such as Patrick Harvie and Ross Greer, who relied on significant misinformation to push their agenda. The claim that Dr Cass disregarded 98 per cent of papers presented to researchers is false. We believe that the Cass review is a valid scientific document, and that the science does not change just because you cross the River Tweed.

Meghan Gallacher was absolutely correct in pointing out that the SNP-Green Government dithered and delayed in responding and making a decision about the final version of the Cass review. Thank God that clinicians were brave enough to stop the use of puberty blockers. Ash Regan’s intervention, in which she asked for the CMO to appear before Parliament, was important. Why can we not get at least an interim statement and get the CMO to answer questions?

Jenni Minto stated that the Government was not waiting for the Cass report, but it is clear that the SNP Government did not pause the use of puberty blockers. As Jackie Baillie reminded us, the SNP Government has had meetings with Dr Cass throughout. Gillian Mackay seemed to leave out the fact that Dr Cass said that there was poor evidence for puberty blockers and that there must be a multidisciplinary team approach to ensure that mental health and other issues are addressed.

Stigma has no place in society, as Alex Cole-Hamilton said, but I disagree with Alex Cole-Hamilton about where decisions can be taken. For example, the use of mesh was ceased by this Parliament, not by clinicians. When the interim report was produced, it was possible for the Government to pause the use of puberty blockers and take time to discuss the issue with clinicians to make sure that we got the right decisions.

Murdo Fraser brought up the brave story of Sinéad Watson. Dr Cass addressed that issue by saying that irreversible medication must not be given quickly to children but that that should be done via an MDT approach, addressing any other issues that they have. We must apologise to Sinéad Watson, Ritchie Herron and others who were let down by the gender service that they received.

Nobody here denies that trans people exist and nobody here denies trans people’s rights, but nobody’s rights trump other people’s rights—we must all live together. Dr Hilary Cass gave evidence to the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee yesterday and was very generous with her time. We heard that children are gender fluid, not fixed. Puberty blockers are irreversible.

Significant time and effort went into finding all the research in the area. Most importantly, the evidence is simply not there to continue giving these irreversible drugs. Why must the Government insist that children are labelled? Let children be children. Let children experience life. Let children learn. We should never forget that children are vulnerable and that it is our job to protect them. Scottish children will be forever and irreversibly harmed.

The Green amendment that was rejected shows that the Green Party members are science deniers and that the party cares only about dogma and ideology. The same party describes Scots who do not agree with its views as reactionaries and bigots. That was the position of the SNP as well.

We must base our approach on evidence. It is not transphobic to question or review current pathways. Ideology and dogma have no place in medical treatment. We must protect patients who are vulnerable. We must protect our children. It is right that doctors have paused services at the Sandyford clinic, but we need an urgent response to the Cass report from the Government. We must implement the report’s recommendations in full, or will the SNP bow down to Green dogma and remain beholden to that party?

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-13090, in the name of Meghan Gallacher, on implementing the Cass review in Scotland. 15:15
Meghan Gallacher (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
Yesterday, I attended the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee’s meeting to hear directly from Dr Hilary Cass following her review of gender care services...
Rachael Hamilton (Ettrick, Roxburgh and Berwickshire) (Con) Con
Does Meghan Gallacher believe that there is no excuse for the SNP not to implement the recommendations of the Cass review now that it has broken up its tragi...
Meghan Gallacher Con
Absolutely. This is an opportunity to reset, refocus and actually prioritise young people who need the Government’s support. The Cass review is a four-year-...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Ms Gallacher, I ask you to move the motion, please.
Meghan Gallacher Con
I move, That the Parliament welcomes the report submitted by Dr Hilary Cass on gender identity services for children and young people; recognises the report...
The Minister for Public Health and Women’s Health (Jenni Minto) SNP
Just over two weeks ago, I stood in the chamber to emphasise what is undeniably a fact: that young people who are questioning their gender or accessing gende...
Rachael Hamilton Con
Will the minister take an intervention?
Jenni Minto SNP
I am going to make progress. As I made clear in my statement, a senior multidisciplinary clinical team within the chief medical officer’s directorate in the...
Rachael Hamilton Con
Thank you, minister. In her statement, the minister said that discussions between clinical stakeholders on what further involvement may be appropriate were ...
Jenni Minto SNP
The chief medical officer will provide a written update to Parliament on the outcome of that clinical consideration process before the summer recess. I am su...
Ash Regan (Edinburgh Eastern) (Alba) Alba
The minister has just set out that the CMO will seek to provide a written statement to the Parliament on the progress that is being made, but I ask the Gover...
Jenni Minto SNP
Currently, the CMO is going to provide a written statement, and that is the way that I think the update should be delivered to Parliament. I know that colle...
Paul Sweeney (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
Will the minister give way on that point?
Jenni Minto SNP
I need to make progress. As part of our work, the Scottish Government is clear that there needs to be transparency. We therefore agree that the CMO will wri...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
The Cass review is a considered, evidence-based report that was drawn up by experts. It was led by Dr Hilary Cass, former president of the Royal College of P...
Fergus Ewing (Inverness and Nairn) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Jackie Baillie Lab
I am about to close. We have asked for openness and transparency, with the new working group publishing papers and minutes. I understand that the Government...
Gillian Mackay (Central Scotland) (Green) Green
It is undeniable that homophobia and transphobia are on the rise, and that is absolutely true when it comes to the weaponisation of the Cass review. The deba...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Members, please show some courtesy and respect to the speaker who has the floor.
Gillian Mackay Green
We have to be aware that the Cass review was a review of services and treatment pathways in NHS England that differ from those in Scotland. As many members h...
Paul Sweeney Lab
Will the member take an intervention on that point?
Gillian Mackay Green
I will.
Paul Sweeney Lab
Does the member agree that a key risk that was raised at this week’s meeting of the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee was the fact that the long waits—...
Gillian Mackay Green
Yes—absolutely. The other thing that was highlighted at committee was the on-going distress and mental health issues for those young people who experience lo...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
I am grateful for the opportunity to speak for the Liberal Democrats in this important debate. Although it is a sensitive matter, it is important that we deb...
Jackie Baillie Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Alex Cole-Hamilton LD
I am afraid that I do not have time; I have only four minutes. NHS Greater Glasgow and Clyde has paused the use of puberty blockers at that clinic to allow ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the open debate. I advise members that we have no time in hand and that back-bench speeches are up to four minutes maximum. 15:41
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
Sinéad Watson is one of the bravest people whom I have ever met. Sinéad is a detransitioner and someone whom I first heard speak in the Parliament four years...