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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 20 March 2024

20 Mar 2024 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
Mason, John SNP Glasgow Shettleston Watch on SPTV

I am pleased to make a short contribution to the debate on behalf of the Finance and Public Administration Committee. As members might know, my committee colleagues are in London for a meeting of the interparliamentary finance committee forum, so you are stuck with me—I think that I am also the oldest member of the committee.

The committee has scrutinised the bill’s financial memorandum, and I would like to highlight some of the key issues that we identified in our report, which was published on 30 November last year. Our report raised concerns about the lack of certainty and potential underestimates in the FM. We noted that a number of the bill’s provisions remain subject to co-design and, therefore, do not have clear associated costs at this stage. Even so, the evidence that the committee received suggested that the FM underestimates costs in relation to enforcement, education and communication campaigns and the infrastructure required to ensure that local authorities are able to adhere to the mandatory code of practice.

A 100 per cent payment rate for fixed penalty notices, which is assumed in the financial memorandum, is incredibly unlikely. Our report raised further concerns regarding the interaction of the bill with related schemes, including the deposit return scheme and the United Kingdom-wide extended producer responsibility scheme. We received evidence that those have created an uncertain environment, which has led to local authorities entering into short-term contracts that can provide little value for money. In relation to local councils, there is also the issue of their coming into alignment with the existing code of practice, which Zero Waste Scotland estimates is costing about £88 million.

The Scottish Government’s response to the report, which was received last week, provides some additional clarity on areas such as enforcement costs and the publication of a national litter and fly-tipping strategy year 1 action plan in May 2024. We also note the minister’s commitment to provide regular updates on costings as regulations are developed.

However, as has been the case with other bills recently, the finance committee remains concerned about the Scottish Government’s approach of introducing a framework bill and using co-design to develop the detail of the policy as the bill progresses through Parliament. Although we do not disagree with the principles of co-design and engaging with stakeholders on policy proposals, both of which support better outcomes and improve decision making, we are unconvinced by the argument that co-design and engagement must follow the legislative process instead of being used to inform and refine policy proposals in advance of legislation being introduced.

The increasing use of framework bills that seek to provide future Governments with enabling powers and that do not, as a result, enable the best estimates of all the costs, savings and changes in revenue to be identified risks the Parliament passing legislation that might, once outcomes are fully understood, be unaffordable. Ultimately, we believe that it poses long-term risks to the Scottish budget, both now and for future Governments.

The finance committee still has reservations about the sequencing that the Scottish Government has opted for in introducing this bill, and, as is stated in our report, we are not convinced that the FM meets the requirements set out in the Parliament’s standing orders to provide

“best estimates of the costs, savings, and changes to revenues to which the provisions of the Bill would give rise”.

We will scrutinise closely the updates on the expenditure that would be incurred, as has been committed to by the minister, alongside any savings that would arise from the bill, but we request that those updates be provided every six months, as the committee recommended, rather than as the regulations are developed, as is proposed by the minister.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-12552, in the name of Lorna Slater, on the Circular Economy (Scotland) Bill at stage 1. I invite members ...
The Minister for Green Skills, Circular Economy and Biodiversity (Lorna Slater) Green
I am delighted to open the debate on the bill. I thank the Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee for its stage 1 report, and the Finance and Public Admini...
Maurice Golden (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
As a result of the measures, when will the 2013 household waste recycling target be met?
Lorna Slater Green
The member rightly brings attention to some of the challenges that we face with meeting historical targets in this area. That is exactly why the bill needs t...
Alex Rowley (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
Does the minister accept the Finance and Public Administration Committee’s concerns about where the funding will come from? Does she accept that local author...
Lorna Slater Green
I am grateful to the member for raising that very good point. I have committed to co-design with local authorities of how we move forward with implementing a...
Douglas Lumsden (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
Will the minister take an intervention?
Lorna Slater Green
I will take one more.
Douglas Lumsden Con
Has COSLA raised concerns about the funding that councils will require to implement some elements of the bill?
Lorna Slater Green
It has indeed. As I just said in response to Alex Rowley, I am absolutely aware that investment will be needed in order to do that. We are looking at other s...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I am pleased to speak on behalf of the Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee. I thank two groups of people. First, I thank my committee colleagues for all...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
I am pleased to make a short contribution to the debate on behalf of the Finance and Public Administration Committee. As members might know, my committee col...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Maurice Golden to open on behalf of the Scottish Conservatives. 15:13
Maurice Golden (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
At the outset, I note that the Scottish Conservatives support the general principles of the bill. A circular economy is an economic system whereby materials ...
Lorna Slater Green
I remind the member, although I am sure that he knows, that Glasgow City Council has recently received the largest tranche of recycling improvement fund mone...
Maurice Golden Con
My point is that Glasgow City Council has proven year on year that it does not care about driving up household recycling rates. That is its track record, and...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I invite Sarah Boyack to open on behalf of Scottish Labour. 15:20
Sarah Boyack (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I welcome today’s debate, because Scottish Labour strongly supports the principle of legislation on the circular economy. However, I echo the point that a lo...
Maurice Golden Con
I am very interested in the success in Wales that Sarah Boyack has described. Does she support the Welsh Government’s approach being applied to Scotland?
Sarah Boyack Lab
What is key is that we have co-operation, partnership and funding. That is the critical issue that I want to come on to. I have welcomed the work of the Net ...
Lorna Slater Green
Will the member take an intervention?
Sarah Boyack Lab
If it is very brief.
Lorna Slater Green
I want to clarify a point to ensure that the member has not misunderstood me. The provision for fining local authorities, which is the Welsh approach, is the...
Sarah Boyack Lab
I hope that I will get some of my time back.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
You get a bit of time back, Ms Boyack.
Sarah Boyack Lab
Thank you for that. When the minister goes into detail is when we get worried, is it not? In the way that she presented what she would change at stage 2, I ...
Bob Doris (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (SNP) SNP
Will the member give way on that point?
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
The member is bringing her remarks to a close.
Sarah Boyack Lab
I need to get to the end of my speech. We cannot ignore the issue of how much waste we export from Scotland, and we know that our consumption emissions have...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
You must bring your remarks to a close, Ms Boyack.