Committee
Constitution, Europe, External Affairs and Culture Committee 11 January 2024
11 Jan 2024 · S6 · Constitution, Europe, External Affairs and Culture Committee
Item of business
Budget Scrutiny 2024-25
Lori Anderson (Culture Counts)
Watch on SPTV
Thank you for inviting Culture Counts to return to the committee to provide post-budget evidence. I thank the committee for its work on pre-budget scrutiny and its attention to the challenges and the evidence that has been provided. I also thank the Cabinet Secretary for the Constitution, External Affairs and Culture, Angus Robertson, for securing additional investment for culture in the 2024-25 budget. There is no lack of understanding of the challenges that the budget presented. I will begin by reflecting on the committee’s report, which we welcome That report recognised that the perfect storm is far from over, and that sustained and significant challenges lie ahead for the sector. We agree with the report’s conclusion that there has, in the past 12 months, been some limited progress towards developing new and innovative funding solutions—in particular, through multiyear funding settlements and cross-portfolio working. We support the committee’s call for urgent action on that and are pleased to see a number of those things in the refreshed cultural action plan. However, we would have liked the report to go a little further towards calling for reinstatement of the cut that we experienced, which happened almost during the previous meeting. We would also like to have seen being brought forward, to make it part of this budget, the very welcome £100 million investment over the next five years. Our on-going aspiration is that 1 per cent of the overall Scottish Government budget would be invested in culture. The committee has supported that ask in the past; we would have liked that to continue. I turn to the budget. Any increased investment is welcome in the current climate, and is certainly a move in the right direction. However, the settlement that has been provided does not contain a huge amount to celebrate. I will comment on a couple of areas and will leave those who receive funding directly from the Government to respond and to draw their own conclusions. I know that representatives of Creative Scotland will be here later to make their own comments, but we were pleased to see that the £6.6 million, or 10 per cent, that had been cut from its settlement has been restored. We understand that a further £6.6 million has been provided to cover what was lost from reserves, so the funding that Creative Scotland has received is not actually new investment. Also, in common with what has happened to many others in the public sector, a 5 per cent efficiency saving has been imposed. What that means for Creative Scotland, and particularly for the regularly funded organisations programme for 2024-25, is that those organisations will continue to be on standstill funding and that the proposed investment for culture is not being passed down to those organisations. I will let others come in in a moment, but the other area that I would like to draw attention to is the non-national museums that are not part of Creative Scotland’s portfolio. They are funded by Museums Galleries Scotland and 439 of the 449 museums will experience a cut in their funding, which means that they will have significant challenges in adequately resourcing their operations in the coming year. For the organisations that will see an increase, that is incredibly important and very welcome after many years of standstill funding, but the impact of a standstill in long-term investment, coupled with high inflation, will reduce the real-terms value of any increase. In addition, as we have said at previous meetings, the on-going recovery from the impacts of Covid, the cost of living crisis, high energy and utility bills and the requirement to meet the challenge of paying the real living wage will mean that the settlements are unlikely to adequately cover the increased costs. To conclude, I say that we hugely welcome the increases and are happy to see the budget moving in the right direction. However, a serious amount of investment is needed now, and from within the current budget—not over a five-year period. The money is welcome, but we need it now and our reflection is that the investment does not go far enough, either in amount or pace.
In the same item of business
The Convener (Clare Adamson)
SNP
I wish you a good morning and a warm welcome to the first meeting in 2024 of the Constitution, Europe, External Affairs and Culture Committee. Happy new year...
Lori Anderson (Culture Counts)
Thank you for inviting Culture Counts to return to the committee to provide post-budget evidence. I thank the committee for its work on pre-budget scrutiny a...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you. I invite Anne Lyden to make some comments.
Anne Lyden (National Galleries of Scotland)
Thank you for inviting me along this morning. This is my first week in my new role, and I am very happy to be here, representing National Galleries of Scotla...
The Convener
SNP
I welcome Leonie Bell to the meeting. Our opening questions were about whether the Scottish Government’s budget and the new strategy meet the committee’s rec...
Leonie Bell (V&A Dundee)
I apologise for being slightly late. Thank you for having V&A Dundee here this morning. As people have probably seen, V&A Dundee’s budget settlement...
Fiona Sturgeon Shea (Federation of Scottish Theatre)
I thank the committee for inviting me here. This is my second time at a committee meeting, but the first time was during the Covid pandemic. Meeting online w...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you very much, Fiona. I will move to Sam, who joins us online.
Sam Dunkley (Musicians Union)
Good morning. Thanks for the invitation to join you today. Reflecting on the budget that was announced, the feeling among our members and colleagues is that...
The Convener
SNP
Shona McCarthy, would you like to come in next?
Shona McCarthy (Edinburgh Festival Fringe Society)
I thank the committee for having the Edinburgh Festival Fringe Society here this morning—it is great to be here. I promised myself that I would approach this...
Simon Hunt (Scottish Opera)
Thank you for inviting us. My colleagues around the table have made a lot of the points that I wanted to make, so I will focus on the issues that are specifi...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you very much. I now call Francesca Hegyi.
Francesca Hegyi OBE (Edinburgh International Festival)
Thank you for inviting me back. Because I have the privilege of speaking last, you can almost guarantee that everything that I was going to say has already b...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you all for your opening contributions. I am now going to move to questions from members. We do not have a lot of time this morning, as we have a secon...
Neil Bibby (West Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Good morning to the panel. We have heard a lot about the on-going crisis in funding and we have previously discussed the perfect storm that is affecting fund...
Francesca Hegyi
It is sad to see those levels of participation drop off. There are probably two main reasons for that, and you have alighted on the first one, which is that ...
Simon Hunt
We certainly experienced a big drop-off as a result of Covid. There has been a change to audience behaviour and, quite markedly, the quickest to return was o...
Fiona Sturgeon Shea
I want to feed back from the conversations that we have been having recently. The majority of members are saying that there is no doubt that they are having ...
Leonie Bell
We have to analyse it beyond just the culture funding levels and what the culture sector does. We operate in and are deeply attuned to the wider local, natio...
Shona McCarthy
I was going to say pretty much what Leonie Bell has said. It is about people’s disposable income. The impact of the cost of living crisis makes people much c...
Neil Bibby
Lab
Thank you for those answers. A number of you mentioned the local context and local government funding. We have talked about the national budget, and Culture ...
The Convener
SNP
Shona McCarthy mentioned the visitor levy. Do you want to expand on your thoughts on that?
Shona McCarthy
We welcome the visitor levy, as a concept. However, so far, I have mostly seen an ever-growing list of what gaps the levy income might be used to plug. That ...
Lori Anderson
To pick up on Neil Bibby’s point about local authorities, they are another important backbone of the investment in local and regional cultural services and v...
Simon Hunt
I note that this week, south of the border—I have not heard of anything quite so alarming in Scotland—Suffolk County Council announced a 100 per cent reducti...
Sam Dunkley
I have a couple of points. We have had contact from our members to say that they are starting to see local councils revisiting the idea of cutting or vastly ...
Donald Cameron (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
I thank all the panel members for their candid evidence. I have two questions. The first is about salary costs, and particularly public sector pay awards, wh...
Anne Lyden
To answer that point, yes, the efficiency saving in effect cancels out that money. It feels as though we are being handed a perceived uplift with one hand an...
Francesca Hegyi
On the question about salaries, we are not governed by the same public sector salary requirements. In practice, that means that we often do not pay at the sa...