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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 11 January 2024

11 Jan 2024 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Public Service Values

What a pompous and insensitive title for a debate. We have heard lofty speeches about “Wha’s like us?” at a time when people are stuck in ambulances outside accident and emergency departments and are waiting in pain on ever-longer NHS waiting lists; when children from poor backgrounds are stuck in poor educational outcomes; when people who are desperate for a home see the SNP Government slash the housing budget; and when the drug death rate remains the highest in Europe.

This debate is a sign of a Government that has lost touch with the lives of ordinary people and their struggles. The debate is not about public service values: it is all about the SNP Government setting out its excuses and providing cover for what will be a savage budget ahead. Ministers are hunting for everyone and anyone as the cause of what is a financial predicament of their own making. Brexit, the Tories, the pandemic and probably, somehow, also the Welsh Labour Government and Keir Starmer are all to blame, according to the SNP, as the true cause of the SNP’s own mismanagement of the public finances and failure to reform public services.

I have a test. The more the SNP people hunt for blame, the more we know the deep financial hole they are in. I agree that the Conservatives have been a terrible Government, and I agree that Brexit is damaging, too, but those are not new revelations. They have not just happened: we have known about them for some time.

Why is the SNP suddenly surprised and panicking now? We have heard for years the warnings from the Christie commission, Audit Scotland and the Scottish Fiscal Commission. Take the Scottish Fiscal Commission. It warned in May 2018 that the Scottish Government was facing a £1.7 billion shortfall in public finances over the following five years. The commission said back then—five years ago—that expected wage growth reductions would result in a significant drop in income tax revenues, as Scotland’s economy would lag behind that of the rest of the UK, with growth remaining below 1 per cent a year until 2023—which was last year.

The Auditor General warned at least as far back as 2018—again, five years ago—that the NHS was not in a financially sustainable position. He repeated his warnings in November 2022. He said that

“Failure to make the necessary changes to how public services are delivered will likely mean further budget pressures in the future”.

Now, Scotland’s NHS boards are forecasting a deficit of £395 million this year. Way back in 2011, 13 years ago, the Christie commission warned about the need to increase preventative spend to stop demand swamping public service capacity.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-11831, in the name of Shona Robison, on Scotland’s public service values. I invite those members who wish...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Finance (Shona Robison) SNP
People across Scotland, including all of us in the chamber, rely on public services, whether we are talking about the high-quality education and training tha...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
I very much agree with the cabinet secretary in relation to the reforms of the police and fire services and about the decluttering of the public service land...
Shona Robison SNP
Yes, I do. There is a lot of opportunity and scope for shared services and public bodies working together and, in some cases, potentially merging. However, w...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I am still a bit shocked that the cabinet secretary is relying on police reform as an example of great reform by the Scottish Government. We had three chief ...
Shona Robison SNP
The most important outcome of police reform is the outcomes for victims of serious crime, particularly sexual offences, rape and murder, and the results that...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I take this opportunity to interject. If members wish to raise an issue, they know that there are ways to do that, including by standing up and seeking to ma...
Shona Robison SNP
As I said, it is estimated that 90,000 fewer children will live in relative and absolute poverty in 2023-24. Notably, poverty levels are lower in Scotland th...
Jackson Carlaw (Eastwood) (Con) Con
Inward migration into the UK was at a record level last year, but that was not the case for Scotland. Why?
Shona Robison SNP
Actually, if we look at net in-migration from the rest of the UK, at least 10,000 people—who may have come from various parts of the world previously—are mov...
Stephen Kerr (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
Will the member give way?
Shona Robison SNP
No, thank you. In December, I provided the Finance and Public Audit Committee with a detailed update that set out the Government’s aims and principles for a...
Sandesh Gulhane (Glasgow) (Con) Con
I draw members’ attention to my entry in the register of members’ interests, as a practising NHS general practitioner. We have listened to the Deputy First ...
Shona Robison SNP
The member mentioned health and social care, which gives me an opportunity to ask him why his Government is reducing health and social care spending. It is d...
Sandesh Gulhane Con
I think that the Deputy First Minister needs to concentrate on the facts. Not only is this the Scottish Parliament, but you are in charge of healthcare here ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I remind all members that they need to speak through the chair. Otherwise, they are referring to me, and I have no responsibility in that regard.
Sandesh Gulhane Con
It is little wonder that, on 20 November 2023, the Deputy First Minister refused to confirm, when asked, whether SNP ministers always tell the truth. Today,...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Members!
Sandesh Gulhane Con
In the same way, the SNP Government decided not to spend on Scotland’s NHS the £18 billion that it has received by way of consequentials from NHS spending do...
Alasdair Allan (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP) SNP
Will Sandesh Gulhane give way?
Sandesh Gulhane Con
No. Other examples are the spending of £7 million per year on pretend overseas embassies, millions of pounds on a failed deposit return scheme and hundreds ...
Stephen Kerr Con
Will Sandesh Gulhane take an intervention?
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Dr Gulhane is about to conclude.
Sandesh Gulhane Con
I would take Stephen Kerr’s intervention if I could. We need to grasp the thistle. Reform is possible if there is a will to do it. The SNP’s raising of taxa...
Michael Marra (North East Scotland) (Lab) Lab
There is a very important discussion to be had about the urgently needed reform of our public services in Scotland, in order that they be fit to meet the hug...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Mr Marra is seated and has concluded his remarks. 15:24
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
What a pompous and insensitive title for a debate. We have heard lofty speeches about “Wha’s like us?” at a time when people are stuck in ambulances outside ...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
Will the member give way?
Willie Rennie LD
No. Despite all those warnings, which stretch back years, it is apparently now someone else’s fault. The panic among SNP ministers has been concerning to ob...
Alasdair Allan SNP
Will the member give way?