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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 05 December 2023

05 Dec 2023 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Disability Equality and Human Rights
Chapman, Maggie Green North East Scotland Watch on SPTV

I give special thanks to the disabled people’s organisations that provided briefings for the debate. Most of them included testimonies that give voice to the lived experience of those who are easy to ignore, for which I am very grateful. Kate Forbes and other members have eloquently and powerfully highlighted the importance of giving voice to the beautiful diversity of disabled people who live across Scotland.

Those and many other testimonies, such as those in the Joseph Rowntree Foundation’s recent study on destitution, bring home to us starkly and vividly the terrible experience of so many disabled people in the UK through current and recent crises. The Covid pandemic, the cost—or, rather, the greed—crisis and the extreme weather events that have been triggered by climate change have hit disabled people the hardest and have forced them to make heartbreaking decisions that threaten their health, their wellbeing and, very often, their lives.

Those extraordinary events are becoming the new normal, but the old normal is not working for disabled people, either, through practical exclusion from decisions about their own healthcare, from grass-roots political expression, from public transport and pavements, and from meeting the basic needs of everyday life.

Why are we still here, after decades of growing consciousness and awareness of disabled people’s voices, and after the brilliant, brave and painstaking work of organisations and activists? Why is the UK not only neglecting disabled people’s interests but, through Westminster’s vicious social security policies, actively undermining and attacking them? Part of the answer is in the UK Government’s macho idea of being there to protect people like them—the rich, the powerful and the so-called able-bodied.

In civilian as well as in military spheres, the most vulnerable people, including disabled people, are acceptable collateral damage. It is time to turn that completely on its head: it is time to acknowledge that vulnerability and interdependence are the natural state of the human condition. Rational economic man, independent and self-reliant, is not the norm, but is a fictional aberration. Starting from an understanding that we all need help, support and one another leads us to an ethic of care in place of domination.

What does that mean for policy in practice and for the important initiatives that the motion highlights, such as the independent living fund, the immediate priorities that are planned for disabled people and the proposed human rights bill? What does it mean for the way in which we achieve the outcomes of Scotland’s national performance framework?

I believe that we must, led by that ethic of care, prioritise four principles: human rights, equality, participation and redistribution. Human rights are just that—the rights of all humans, regardless of identity or status. They are the soil in which our lives can flourish and grow.

There are two ways in which states commonly act to deny us realisation of our rights. One is by paying lip service to them and hiding them in plain sight, pretending that human rights have already been achieved and that we need not worry about them. I am proud and grateful that, here in Scotland, we have a civil society, not least in disabled people’s organisations themselves, that will not let us do that.

The second way to deny rights is to try to eradicate them altogether by attacking the very concept and legitimacy of human rights and by promoting the narrative that they are not for all of us but are merely a means for the unscrupulous to obtain, by legal manipulation, what they do not deserve. That is a dangerous lie, but one that is increasingly espoused by those on the right of the Tory party who want to drag the UK out of its honoured place in the European convention on human rights.

I am, I say again, proud and grateful to be in Scotland, where our political and social traditions stand for solidarity and care. Having human rights as a nice luxury and something to enjoy only when the going is good is not how we want to function here.

Equality is about overcoming the many obstacles to taking part in social, economic, cultural and political life that are faced by all marginalised groups, and especially by disabled people. We must consider equality not as something that is the subject of a one-off assessment, but as something that is assessed at all stages of development and in relation to all policy areas. We should do that with consciousness that—as Peter Beresford has pointed out—inequality itself can diminish our awareness of power differences, because those who are excluded do not realise how much they are excluded from, and those who have easy access take that for granted.

Genuine participation is also key. I again recognise and honour the disabled people’s organisations that have, in many ways, pioneered the work on participation. Disabled people have been and, shamefully, often still are shut out of the decisions about policy and practice that are central to their own lives. Undeterred, the movement boldly challenged the accepted ideology, revealed the threadbare nature of medical and individualistic models, and developed the social model of disability and the philosophy of independent living. Neither of those ideas has been fully accepted in mainstream political thinking, although they are often hastily put in there when doing so is politically convenient, but are shrugged off again when no one is looking. We can do better, here.

Finally, an ethic of care requires redistribution. Policies and plans, when they are sensitively and wisely developed, can take us a long way, but practical change also requires resources. We must be brave and honest in speaking about and acting on the scale that is required.

The Social Care Future movement talks of

“the place we call home”

and of

“communities where we look out for one another”.

My vision, and hope, is for a Scotland where both of those are true for disabled people and for all of us. When we achieve that, our ambitions to have human rights not only enshrined in our laws, but realised by all our people, will be met.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur) LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-11537, in the name of Emma Roddick, on championing disability equality and human rights. 14:47
The Minister for Equalities, Migration and Refugees (Emma Roddick) SNP
I am very glad to be speaking to the motion, because, for many reasons, it is an important time of year for us to mark. First, we are just five days away fro...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
I do not disagree with anything that the minister has said thus far in an excellent speech. Does she agree that the gold standard for protecting the rights o...
Emma Roddick SNP
That is an excellent point. The member will be aware that the UNCRPD is one of four treaties that we are seeking to incorporate into Scots law as part of our...
Oliver Mundell (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Con
That is not the feedback that I often get from young people in my constituency. Those living in rural areas find those programmes very hard to access, and go...
Emma Roddick SNP
Oliver Mundell asked me recently about that particular service, and I am more than happy to reach out and speak again about what is happening. Obviously, our...
Paul O’Kane (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Does the minister recognise the significant challenges in relation to delays in the administration of ADP and the challenging wait times to get through to So...
Emma Roddick SNP
Absolutely. I would point out that Social Security Scotland has taken urgent action around decision making to speed it up. In the past quarter, we processed ...
Miles Briggs (Lothian) (Con) Con
I apologise for the delay in my attendance in the chamber. I will open with the words of Natasha Hamilton, daughter of Anne Duke, who gave evidence last mon...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
Please resume your seat for a second, Mr Briggs. I am finding your speech very interesting, but I am looking at the amendment that was selected—although it h...
Miles Briggs Con
I absolutely am. The cases that I am referring to relate to individuals who had complex needs and care needs during the pandemic. Indeed, the first line of m...
Paul O’Kane (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am pleased to participate in the debate and to speak about the experience of disabled people in Scotland so soon after the international day of persons wit...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
I am grateful to the Government for bringing its motion to the chamber for debate. When I think back to my time as convener of the for Scotland’s disabled ch...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
On that point, is the member aware of the stark statistic that three out of four users of the Trussell Trust’s food banks are from a household with a disable...
Alex Cole-Hamilton LD
Something is fundamentally wrong in our provision—in the safety net that we in this place seek to provide for families affected by disability—if such a dispr...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We now move to the open debate. I remind all members who wish to speak in the debate to ensure that they have pressed their request-to-speak buttons. 15:25
Kate Forbes (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) SNP
The aim captured in the Government’s motion is that all disabled people should have freedom, dignity, choice and control over their lives. I hope that all of...
Alex Cole-Hamilton LD
I very much enjoyed listening to the story of Kate Forbes’s uncle, but before she told us that story, she talked about giving people with disabilities a voic...
Kate Forbes SNP
That is absolutely fair and right. It is not just about listening to disabled people, but about having the courage to introduce policies that reflect the div...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We have quite a bit of time in hand, so interventions can easily be taken without any reduction in speaking time. With that, I call Annie Wells to be followe...
Annie Wells (Glasgow) (Con) Con
I welcome the chance today to talk about the challenges that disabled people face in Scotland. There is much in the motion that we can welcome. We agree that...
Kate Forbes SNP
I appreciate the member’s contribution. I am not sure that drug and alcohol deaths are specific to the discussion on disabled people that we are having right...
Annie Wells Con
My colleague Jeremy Balfour has proposed a bill to introduce a disability commissioner. We support increasing the distance in the adult disability payment mo...
Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) SNP
Worldwide, more than 1 billion people are disabled, and in Scotland, that figure is well over 1 million. That is a quarter of our population whose day-to-day...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Pam Duncan-Glancy, who joins us online. 15:45
Pam Duncan-Glancy (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
The Scottish Parliament—rightly—always recognises the international day of disabled people, and we should be very proud of that. However, this year sees a ma...
Karen Adam (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
It is a privilege to talk on this subject. It is no secret to the Parliament that campaigning for human rights is a deep passion of mine, mostly because of t...
Martin Whitfield (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
It is a real pleasure to follow Karen Adam’s very powerful speech. Her ability to illustrate her childhood resulted in me almost being transported into that ...
Clare Haughey (Rutherglen) (SNP) SNP
I am pleased to contribute to today’s debate. The World Health Organization estimates that around 1.3 billion people worldwide—roughly one in six—have some f...
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
I give special thanks to the disabled people’s organisations that provided briefings for the debate. Most of them included testimonies that give voice to the...