Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 09 November 2023
09 Nov 2023 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Fair Work in a Wellbeing Economy
As I said, I welcome the Fair Work Convention’s report. It provides a very helpful measure of where we are and the progress that we are making, but it is also challenging in saying where we need to go further.
We continue to work with the Fair Work Convention—I meet it regularly—and I support the measures that it has suggested in relation to the areas that need more work. We are already considering those areas in relation to our fair work action plans to ensure that we respond not just to the needs that the Fair Work Convention identified but to the matters that trade union organisations have raised in relation to the devolution of employment law, which the Labour Party’s amendment appears to ignore.
A report by the Living Wage Foundation that was published in August indicates that—
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Liam McArthur)
LD
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-11161, in the name of Neil Gray, on fair work in a wellbeing economy. 14:58
The Cabinet Secretary for Wellbeing Economy, Fair Work and Energy (Neil Gray)
SNP
Our vision is for a wellbeing economy that supports fair and green economic growth and that benefits people and communities across Scotland, providing opport...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab)
Lab
Will the minister take an intervention?
Neil Gray
SNP
I will do shortly. In 2023, the gender pay gap for all employees in Scotland was 8.7 per cent, which is lower than the comparable figure for the UK—14.3 per...
Daniel Johnson
Lab
The Fair Work Convention’s report also highlighted a number of areas in which the Scottish Government could go further. Which of those is the most important ...
Neil Gray
SNP
As I said, I welcome the Fair Work Convention’s report. It provides a very helpful measure of where we are and the progress that we are making, but it is als...
Brian Whittle (South Scotland) (Con)
Con
Will the minister give way?
Neil Gray
SNP
Bear with me a second. The report indicates that, in addition to Scotland having the highest levels of pay in the UK, it has the lowest levels of low-paid i...
Brian Whittle
Con
What will the Scottish Government do to tackle the high levels of economically inactive people in Scotland, especially those with ill health?
Neil Gray
SNP
Levels of economic inactivity are too high in Scotland, as they are across the whole of the UK, so we need to look at what can be done to address that. This ...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
Will Neil Gray give way?
Neil Gray
SNP
I will, for the final time.
Murdo Fraser
Con
We are six minutes into the cabinet secretary’s speech and he has not yet mentioned the wording of his motion, in which there is a specific call for the devo...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
Cabinet secretary, I will give you the time back for the intervention.
Neil Gray
SNP
Thank you—I appreciate that. I note that Murdo Fraser’s amendment to the motion contains little more than a passing mention of fair work, which shows the Co...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
We have a little bit of time in hand, so members can have the time back for any interventions that they take. 15:11
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
It has been a rather bizarre debate so far. Interruption. We have had one long speech from the cabinet secretary and various interventions. Despite the fact ...
Ivan McKee (Glasgow Provan) (SNP)
SNP
Will the member give way?
Murdo Fraser
Con
Yes, I will give way to Mr McKee—a member of the Government in exile.
Ivan McKee
SNP
Does Murdo Fraser not recognise that international data clearly shows that countries and economies that prioritise fair work and that have high standards of ...
Murdo Fraser
Con
I know that Mr McKee has a record in business, so he should be listening to what business voices are saying about what the Scottish Government should be focu...
The Minister for Independence (Jamie Hepburn)
SNP
Does Mr Fraser expect us to take seriously the notion of a Conservative member of the Scottish Parliament talking about the need for economic growth when his...
Murdo Fraser
Con
That is nonsense. I do not know whether the minister has looked at what has happened to economies elsewhere in the world. The UK is performing better than ma...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP)
SNP
Would Murdo Fraser accept that there is quite a lot of variety in the business community and that, although some businesses need more support, others are mak...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
LD
I can give you the time back, Mr Fraser.
Murdo Fraser
Con
Mr Mason needs to engage with major figures in the business community, particularly in sectors such as finance, which has a very fluid and flexible workforce...
Neil Gray
SNP
Will the member give way?
Murdo Fraser
Con
No, I have given away about four or five times and really need to make some progress.
Neil Gray
SNP
Three times.
Murdo Fraser
Con
Rather than learn from that experience, this Government wants to go further and to create a different employment law regime here in Scotland. That will not a...