Committee
Criminal Justice Committee 01 June 2022
01 Jun 2022 · S6 · Criminal Justice Committee
Item of business
Fireworks and Pyrotechnic Articles (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2
Good morning. We have a lot to get through today. The amendments in this small group are technical ones that seek to improve the licensing scheme, should it proceed. Amendment 81 to section 10 would simply ensure that ministers make provision for there being paper copies of a person’s licence if, for example, it has been issued digitally. That is simply to provide for people who are unable to access, or are excluded from, the digital world. As we know, that is a common theme that crops up. Amendments 82 and 83 are also technical amendments on that subject, but they relate to section 12 and when a licence has been revoked. Amendment 83 would require that a licence holder must return a paper copy of a licence should the licence be revoked or expire. We might come on to the length of licences. The amendments are aimed at improving the bill by providing commonsense arrangements for issuing and returning licences. They would simply ensure that someone who should no longer have a licence could not still use a licence that has expired or use it in the unlikely event of its having been revoked. I press on the Government the point that we want the licensing scheme to be accessible and open, including digitally, to as many people as possible. For example, in relation to Covid certification over the past couple of years, we have seen where such a system can work well and where it can go wrong. I hope that the amendments are helpful. I appreciate that the minister will probably say that much of what is in them will be dealt with in the secondary legislation that will be introduced when the nature of the scheme has been agreed and pinned down. I respect that, but I think that it would be helpful to include my amendments to improve, where possible, the licensing scheme in advance of its production. I move amendment 81.
In the same item of business
The Convener (Audrey Nicoll)
SNP
I wish you a very good morning. Welcome to the 18th meeting in 2022 of the Criminal Justice Committee. We have received no apologies. We have two main items...
The Convener
SNP
Amendment 81, in the name of Jamie Greene, is grouped with amendments 82 and 83.
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con)
Con
Good morning. We have a lot to get through today. The amendments in this small group are technical ones that seek to improve the licensing scheme, should it...
The Minister for Community Safety (Ash Regan)
SNP
The amendments in group 11 make provisions relating to the format of a fireworks licence. In particular, they set out entitlement to a paper licence and spec...
Jamie Greene
Con
I thank the minister for that response. The reassurance that has been given, with her accepting the point, is helpful and appreciated. For that reason, I wil...
The Convener
SNP
I call Jamie Greene to move amendment 82, which has already been debated with amendment 81.
Jamie Greene
Con
Can I have clarification of the difference between withdrawing and not moving an amendment?
Seán Wixted (Clerk)
If a member is content not to move an amendment, they do not have to—it will not be debated. If an amendment is moved, it must be debated by the committee, a...
The Convener
SNP
Amendment 84, in the name of Jamie Greene, is in a group on its own.
Jamie Greene
Con
Amendment 84 is quite self-explanatory—unusually for an amendment—and is based on the premise of an appeals process. It says: “The Scottish Ministers must p...
Ash Regan
Amendment 84 would require the Scottish ministers to provide information about how to appeal a decision to refuse a licence application, attach a condition t...
The Convener
SNP
Jamie, do you want to wind up or press or withdraw amendment 84?
Jamie Greene
Con
I thank the minister for the offer. I am happy to kick off the morning on a consensual note and agree to work with the minister and her team ahead of stage 3...
The Convener
SNP
The question is, that amendment 86 be agreed to. Are we all agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
SNP
There will be a division. For Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (Con) Against Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) MacG...
The Convener
SNP
The result of the division is: For 2, Against 6, Abstentions 0. Amendment 86 disagreed to. Section 15 agreed to. Section 16—False or altered licences and ...
The Convener
SNP
The question is, that amendment 20 be agreed to. Are we all agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
SNP
There will be a division. For Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) MacGregor, Fulton (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) Mackay, Rona (Strathkelvin and Bearsden...
The Convener
SNP
The result of the division is: For 6, Against 2, Abstentions 0. Amendment 20 agreed to. Amendment 21 moved—Ash Regan—and agreed to. Section 18, as amended...
The Convener
SNP
The question is, that amendment 89 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener
SNP
There will be a division. For Clark, Katy (West Scotland) (Lab) Findlay, Russell (West Scotland) (Con) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (Con) McNeill, Paul...
The Convener
SNP
The result of the division is: For 4, Against 4, Abstentions 0. There is an equality of votes. Therefore, as convener, I shall use my casting vote to vote a...
The Convener
SNP
Amendment 90, in the name of Jamie Greene, is grouped with amendments 56, 129 and 57.
Jamie Greene
Con
I have two amendments in this group and Colette Stevenson has the other two, which I will come on to. My two amendments are on post-legislative scrutiny, w...
Collette Stevenson (East Kilbride) (SNP)
SNP
I am pleased to propose amendments 56 and 57, having raised the issue of post-legislative scrutiny of the bill alongside my colleagues on the Criminal Justic...
Rona Mackay (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP)
SNP
I support Collette Stevenson’s amendments 56 and 57 for the reasons that she has just outlined, which I will not repeat. I do not think that Jamie Greene’s ...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
I thank Jamie Greene and Collette Stevenson for their amendments, which are critical. They all align with the committee’s stage 1 report, in which we all exp...
Fulton MacGregor (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP)
SNP
I speak in support of amendments 56 and 57, in the name of Collette Stevenson, which are a fair reflection of where the committee got to in its discussion of...
Ash Regan
SNP
I thank Ms Stevenson for meeting me to discuss her amendments. I welcome the detail that she has given in highlighting the importance of post-legislative scr...
Pauline McNeill
Lab
I talked about the licensing scheme, which Jamie Greene’s amendment 90 refers to.