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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament (Hybrid) 10 June 2021

10 Jun 2021 · S6 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Justice System

They are welcome changes, but they do not go far enough or fast enough. We go back to November 2019 when justice secretary at the time, Humza Yousaf, stated that the Government would make speedy progress on the issue. The families of those victims—and there are many victims—are sitting there watching the Parliament drag its feet on these issues. That is why we will introduce that bill in the first 100 days of the Parliament, and rightly so.

We also call for proper budgetary support for victims and for support services for victims. It is important to recognise that the third sector plays a crucial role in supporting victims and being the first port of call for them. Equally, the third sector can play a vital role in the preventative agenda, and that issue merits sensible discussion across the chamber. The Green Party amendment alludes to that issue, and I do not disagree.

Four out of 10 prisoners in Scotland report having taken drugs in prison—not before or outside prison but in it—and nearly half of prisoners were under the influence of drugs at the time of their arrest. Scotland has the worst drug problem in Europe. Those two statistics do not exist in isolation. Sadly, it is often prison staff who bear the brunt of the situation.

Our amendment also calls for the doubling of sentences for crimes against emergency services workers, which is a call that has largely fallen on deaf ears in recent years. Our view on the issue is clear: it is only right that those who go out of their way to harm our front-line personnel are punished accordingly. Why? It is because, last year, there were on average 20 attacks a day on Scottish police officers and staff. According to the Scottish Police Federation, 50 per cent of our police officers are facing burnout. To anyone in the chamber who has any doubt about the gravity of the issue, the Scottish police memorial, which sits in the grounds of the Scottish Police College, should serve as a stark and visible reminder of the sacrifice that police officers have made. [Interruption.] I am sorry, but I will not give way, as I have a lot to cover.

I want to reaffirm our position on the presumption against short sentences. I listened carefully to what the cabinet secretary said on that. I presume that the rationale behind the presumption is that the Government wants more offenders to receive alternatives to prison. That is fine, but what has happened to those alternatives? We know that the slate was wiped clean on 300,000 hours of community service sentences. Alternatives to prison must be meaningful, and they must command the confidence of the public, who have the right to understand that justice has truly been served.

The final call in our amendment is on the anomaly of Scotland’s not proven verdict, which has been alluded to. I admit that there are mixed views on the issue in the chamber and in the legal profession, but that cannot and should not be a barrier to ending what has long been a curious and often misunderstood and controversial verdict in Scots law.

It is abundantly clear that there are structural issues that must be dealt with in Scotland. How can our legal institutional frameworks be improved to truly better serve victims and their families? [Interruption.] I am sorry, but I am in my closing minute. That point is raised by the Liberal Democrats in relation to fatal accident inquiries. The Liberal Democrats make a valid point and we on the Conservative benches will support it at decision time.

That ties in with the call for much-needed reform of the role of the Lord Advocate. The First Minister has acknowledged and conceded the need for reform, following the saga of the Alex Salmond trial and the shambolic and wrongful prosecution of two men in relation to the sale of Rangers Football Club, which cost taxpayers £20 million, and rising. That points towards embedded flaws that remain unaddressed but which must be addressed if we are to stand a chance of achieving full public confidence.

None of the above is exhaustive. There is a crisis of recruitment and retention in our legal aid sector. For example, one defence lawyer has said:

“we are staring into an abyss ... Trouble for the sector now is trouble for the entire legal system in the future.”

He is right. The whole system is creaking at the seams.

The topic of judicial reform should not be controversial. If Parliament collectively agrees to reset the balance of our justice system back towards the interests of victims, we must and should find common ground to do so. Equally, where clear blue water exists between the parties’ approaches, we on the Conservative benches are proud to be the voice of those in society whose rights have often been lost in the debate. If the Government is serious about a shift towards standing up for victims, it must show that through action. If the victims law does not materialise in Government time, we will put it on the radar in our time, and others will put barriers in its way at their peril. We owe that to victims. It is time to act.

I move amendment S6M-00294.1, to insert at end:

“; calls for victims to be put at the heart of Scotland’s justice system through the introduction of a Victims Law that will deliver restorative justice and implement measures to protect the rights of victims, including the introduction of Suzanne’s Law and Michelle’s Law; further calls for victims services to be properly funded; calls for sentences to be doubled for attacks on Scotland’s emergency workers; further calls for an end to the presumption against short prison sentences and the introduction of whole life sentences for the worst offenders, and calls for the not proven verdict in Scots Law to be abolished.”

14:54  
References in this contribution

Motions, questions or amendments mentioned by their reference code.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Annabelle Ewing) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S6M-00294, in the name of Keith Brown, on justice: recover, renew, transform. 14:28
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Keith Brown) SNP
I am grateful for the opportunity to consider some of the most important challenges that our justice system faces. I want to use the time to build on my rece...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
Could the proposed new coronavirus legislation that the Government wants to introduce, and the powers that would then exist, lead to people on remand staying...
Keith Brown SNP
To be honest, I am not sure about the connection that the member makes between the powers in the coronavirus legislation and the extension of remand, but I a...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
We have discussed the issue before, but when we carried out the reform that extended sheriff court sentencing powers to five years, it was always intended th...
Keith Brown SNP
We have discussed the issue previously, and Pauline McNeill will know that officials were on that call. Although I am happy to come back to her with a fuller...
Liam Kerr (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
Will the cabinet secretary be addressing policing at any point? I ask because there was a good question at First Minister’s question time today about body-wo...
Keith Brown SNP
I heard and understood the First Minister’s response earlier. We are willing to investigate the matter. I am sure that Liam Kerr is aware that there are a nu...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I am very pleased to open for the Scottish Conservatives in my first justice debate. I took on the education brief just a month before the pandemic hit, and ...
Keith Brown SNP
I am more than willing to engage in that discussion. The member will have heard what I said about a victims commissioner and additional trauma support for vi...
Jamie Greene Con
They are welcome changes, but they do not go far enough or fast enough. We go back to November 2019 when justice secretary at the time, Humza Yousaf, stated ...
Pauline McNeill (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I thank the Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Veterans, and the Minister for Community Safety, Ash Denham, for meeting me yesterday. I hope that we can conti...
Keith Brown SNP
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Pauline McNeill Lab
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Keith Brown SNP
That is what the courts service and the figures say that the date will be. Yesterday, I made the point that it should be down to us all to see whether we can...
Pauline McNeill Lab
I acknowledge that point—let us see what progress we can make. Like Jamie Greene, I want to make a point about the scarcity of legal aid, which has driven m...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Would you bring your remarks to a close, please?
Pauline McNeill Lab
Sorry, Presiding Officer. I was told that I had nine minutes to speak.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
You are down for eight.
Pauline McNeill Lab
I will finish on this point. When it comes to decision time, it would be helpful for us to know what the Green amendment means by “institutional violence”, ...
Maggie Chapman (North East Scotland) (Green) Green
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Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I welcome the cabinet secretary, Jamie Greene and Maggie Chapman to their new roles and Pauline McNeill back to her old stomping ground. She will find that m...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) SNP
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Liam McArthur LD
I certainly accept that there are mitigating circumstances in some instances, but that emphasises the importance of keeping the families of victims informed ...
The Presiding Officer (Alison Johnstone) NPA
We move to the open debate. Members who wish to participate might want to ensure that they have pressed their request-to-speak buttons. 15:15
Michelle Thomson (Falkirk East) (SNP) SNP
I plan to address two areas in this short speech. First, I commend the Scottish Government’s commitment to creating a register of interests for members of t...
Pam Gosal (West Scotland) (Con) Con
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Keith Brown SNP
Can I answer the question?
Pam Gosal Con
I will hold on because I am hoping that the cabinet secretary will respond to the questions when he is summing up. I will get on with some of the words I hav...
Rona Mackay (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) SNP
Before I start my speech, I say that Pam Gosal asked an awful lot of questions in her speech, but was not prepared to listen to answers—which seems to be ver...