Committee
Education and Skills Committee 24 March 2021
24 Mar 2021 · S5 · Education and Skills Committee
Item of business
Coronavirus and Education
The fundamental point that I think that Jamie Greene is looking for me to confirm is that a return to full-time face-to-face schooling in the secondary sector will require the removal of the 2m physical distancing requirement for pupils in classroom settings. That is the assumption on which a full-time return to school is based. In all likelihood, the requirement will remain for physical distancing between adults in schools and between adults and pupils in schools. There will be a need for a whole variety of other mitigation measures to be in place but, fundamentally, the 2m physical distancing requirement will have to be relaxed to enable a full-time return to face-to-face schooling in the secondary sector. The education advisory sub-group has looked at all those questions and it, as well the education recovery group, will have to monitor the data on the prevalence of the virus to determine whether that is a safe assumption for us to operate on when it comes to the moment of returning to schooling. The committee will appreciate that that moment remains a few weeks away. The first return to school after the Easter holidays is 12 April for five or six local authorities, with the remainder returning on 19 April. There is a bit of time to elapse before we can be definitive. We know that the spread of the virus can accelerate, but we hope that that will not be the case. There is a wide variety of societal mitigation factors, not least of which is the extensive prevalence of the vaccination programme. Fundamentally, the assumption about a full-time return to face-to-face schooling in the secondary sector will be predicated on a relaxation of the 2m physical distancing rule for pupils within the school estate and in a classroom setting, but we will likely require pupils to observe other constraints when moving around in school, and there will be further mitigating factors.
In the same item of business
The Convener
SNP
Agenda item 4 is an evidence session on coronavirus and education. We have a strict time limit for this item. I remind members that we want to be clear of it...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney)
SNP
Good morning, and thank you for the opportunity to take part in the committee’s proceedings this morning. As the convener indicated, I will be doing so for t...
The Convener
SNP
Thank you, Mr Swinney. We move to questions from the committee. I remind members that, if they wish to ask a question, they should type R in the chat function.
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con)
Con
Good morning. I apologise in advance for not staying to the end of the committee session. I open with the back-to-school plans. Specifically, does the Gover...
John Swinney
SNP
The fundamental point that I think that Jamie Greene is looking for me to confirm is that a return to full-time face-to-face schooling in the secondary secto...
Jamie Greene
Con
I understand that. It sounded as though there was a yes in there. Before I ask my other question, I will push you on something that you said towards the tail...
John Swinney
SNP
Certainly in relation to the primary sector, I am proceeding on the assumption—although I am not sure that “assumption” is the right word—or on the foundatio...
Jamie Greene
Con
I understand. I am sorry to push the issue—this was not my intended line of questioning, but your answer has expanded on it—but you said that you will wait a...
John Swinney
SNP
The sub-group from which I take a great deal of advice on those questions will meet again on 6 April, so I do not want Mr Greene to leave the conversation th...
Jamie Greene
Con
Thank you for that—that is very helpful. If it is okay, convener, I will ask one substantial question and then leave others to pick up the questioning.
The Convener
SNP
I have a number of members who want to come in. If there is time at the end, I will bring you back in, but I will move on, if you do not mind. I call Daniel ...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab)
Lab
In a sense, my questions follow on from those from Jamie Greene, who asked about the coming academic term. I am interested in the medium to longer term. For...
John Swinney
SNP
In answering Mr Johnson’s question, I go back to the position that prevailed last August. Between last August and December, by and large, we managed to susta...
Daniel Johnson
Lab
Thank you. That gives us a sense of the broad outlook, which would need to be underpinned by guidance and, I presume, a broader set of strategies for dealing...
John Swinney
SNP
I am glad that Mr Johnson has raised the issue, and I am glad that he used the term “catch-up”, because it allows me to air the issue. We have to open up and...
Daniel Johnson
Lab
I have one final question.
The Convener
SNP
Is the question in the same area, Mr Johnson?
Daniel Johnson
Lab
It is about the consequences for the coming academic year.
The Convener
SNP
If it is in the same area, please go ahead, but be brief. If it is not, I will bring you in at the end, once other members have had a chance to come in.
Daniel Johnson
Lab
Critically, there needs to be guidance for the coming academic year that takes account of the risk of new variants that could supersede or overcome protectio...
John Swinney
SNP
Health colleagues and the Government more widely are monitoring closely all the information about possible new variants, which is very material to the contro...
Ross Greer (West Scotland) (Green)
Green
I will follow up on the line of questioning about what the near future will look like—the term from August onwards. Outwith a very small number of children a...
John Swinney
SNP
That is my expectation, yes. Mr Greer has pursued that issue vigorously. The asymptomatic testing programme has been a welcome development and there has been...
Ross Greer
Green
That is excellent to hear. I thank the Government for introducing the programme. This is not my main line of questioning, but are the numbers on participatio...
John Swinney
SNP
I am now looking at a folder, but a number is not leaping out at me yet. I will write to the committee about the numbers. As I said in my opening remarks, in...
Ross Greer
Green
Excellent. Thanks very much. I—
The Convener
SNP
Mr Greer, in fairness to other members, if possible, can you ask a line of questions as one question? If we do not cover everything, I will bring you in agai...
Ross Greer
Green
I entirely appreciate that, convener. I will ask one slightly elongated question. The committee recently heard from the Children and Young People’s Commissi...
John Swinney
SNP
There are two dimensions to that question. The first is about the SQA’s engagement with young people in the determination of the policy and practical approac...
Beatrice Wishart (Shetland Islands) (LD)
LD
I align myself with the cabinet secretary’s comments in his opening remarks in thanking pupils, parents and teaching and support staff for all that they have...